March 31, 2012 at 8:52 am #56586angieBlocked
Apparently cuts of a further 27 billion euros worth, and the Deputy PM says ‘Spain is in a critical situation’.
I understand they expect the 24% unemployment rate to rise further.
How do people on here think this will all pan out? What will be the major implications? What next for property prices? What next for Spain’s Banks?:roll:
March 31, 2012 at 10:44 am #108257
Corporation tax increases of 17% will hurt business, a 12% increase in utility bills will damage household budgets further on top of individual tax increases already announced. Also a 17% cut in all departmental spending will filter through to the street eventually. Medical services are certain to be reduced. Regional governments already cash strapped and burdened with massive debt are facing a very difficult future.
What does this mean for Spain generally and the property sector? In a word disaster. It may satisfy the EU commission and the bond markets but it will damage further the economy, causing for ordinary people more of the same, unemployment and decline.
That said there is no other real alternative for Spain.
March 31, 2012 at 11:19 am #108258katyBlocked
Health budget is reduced by 13.7 (already struggling, waiting lists doubling in some areas)) education by more. Some schools are out of basic educational materials and children now have to take their own toilet paper in valencia. Defence down by 8% and I think they are cutting the overseas aid which is what the UK should have done.
Spain’s unemployment figures out on Tuesday, probably not be much worse as short term recruitment will have started for the summer season.
April 1, 2012 at 1:19 am #108265GarySFBCNParticipant
While I understand the need to reduce overall costs, given the state of the global economy, unless the government invests money into developing or bolstering industry, the unemployment rate will continue to rise.
And Rajoy should tell the EU to stuff it.
April 1, 2012 at 2:02 am #108266
This is something that Rajoy/Spain needs to do but as Gary said he should just tell the EU-maffia to stick it somewhere.
April 1, 2012 at 7:25 am #108267
Nigel Farage has already done just that. 🙂 🙂
April 1, 2012 at 10:23 am #108271
Nigel Farage has already done just that. 🙂 🙂
That address is pushing almost 2 years old now and you have to hand it to Nigel, his prediction are starting to look more like reality.
I have been following the Spanish Housing market for too long and especially too unhealthy for the last 7 years! There now seems to be no end in sight to when the corner will be turned. There’s a natural cycle whereby prices have fallen so far and for so long that people perceive them to be cheap and buyers return, in essence it’s all about confidence, that period will now be prolonged.
You just have to read the thread about tourist licences in Valencia on the regions board to see how screwed Spanish economics is. The banning of luggage on Buses in some other region so taxis can increase trade etc, demolitions of property mainly owner by foreigners etc
Spain seems to have no policies to encourage one of it’s major industries, it’s all about extracting more money out of the sector and suppressing it.
I see little hope for a recovery in the property market for many years unless policies are introduced that stimulate home ownership. We know have stamp duty in the UK at 7% for properties over 2 million. It’s 8% in Spain for all properties!!!
So just to move house for example to a new town for a job will cost you 10% of your property value!!!! Absolutely no incentive to move to find work, progress, become a dynamic economy!
I did this calculation on another forum..
UK stat redundancy about 3 days of pay per year worked (for average salary)
Spain 45 days, but now reduced to 33!
I don’t see Spain recovering for a long time yet !!
April 1, 2012 at 11:09 pm #108278
Is Nigel Farage well liked in the England? If he is not I want to adopt him and bring him over to Sweden. He is such an awesome speaker “albeit a bit populistic” and I have hardly ever disagreed with him. If he is not well liked whats his baggage? Our euro sceptical parties are a welfare party called “left wing party” and then a party called the swedish democrats which in all honesty is a left wing nationalistic party which believes stopping immigration would solve every problem in the world. The sad part is that the swedish democrats is actually hitting the nail on the head on certain issues but for the wrong reasons.
April 2, 2012 at 6:59 am #108279
Can we we do a swap for your Swedish Democrats?
April 2, 2012 at 8:19 am #108280
The problem with UKIP in which Nigel Farage is their leader and MEP is they have a policy of withdrawing from the EU completely. They want an independent Britain separate from political ties with Europe.
That is a step too far for most British people who recognise the economic benefits of being part of a single market.
If UKIP modified that stance they would gain more popular support electorally in Britain.
Farage is a brave maverick politician on the right of the spectrum and I agree with most of his excellent rhetoric except that. Someone has to do it otherwise the EU parliament resembles the communist assemblies in China.
I enjoyed watching all those unelected EU functionaries squirm in their seats as he spoke. 👿
April 2, 2012 at 10:18 am #108283katyBlocked
Nigel Farage seems popular with the average person in the street. However, he and other UKIP members are mocked and derided by mainstream politicians and the media. I don’t see any economic benefits for the UK being in the EU. There are world trade agreements to abide by anyway and a lot of UK exports are outside of Europe.
Main benefits to the UK withdrawing would be the billions of contributions to Brussels (UK pays more in than it gets out!).
Hundreds of thousands of Europeans would no longer be able to claim UK benefits (many young Spanish/Italians etc. use the UK benefits system as a paid gap year) They even get housing benefit to pay their rent!!
Getting rid of terrorists, Roma and all the other flotsam by withdrawing from the Human Rights treaty.
Won’t happen though, not just a gravy train, it’s out of control…. 😈
April 2, 2012 at 10:27 am #108285
This one’s a classic. 😀
April 2, 2012 at 3:30 pm #108288
Can we we do a swap for your Swedish Democrats?
I don’t mind some of their ideas but they are a mild konservative nationalistsocialist party and I’m not sure how they can call them right wing because neither their economic or social policies shows any signs of that. Mostly a way for the mainstream media and politicians to belittle them I guess. Since they are against the current form of immigration they are labled as right wing. Maybe it’s because of the same stupid reasons people always believe the nazis in germany during the WW2 held a right wing policies when in fact even their name “nationalsocialist party” points in the opposite direction with a twist of conservatism in the end of their rule.
1. In the beginning before the night of the long knives this can harldy even be disputed “http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives”
2. The NDSAP set clear goals and the only thing the owners “only owners on paper” of factories could decide upon was how to accomplish these goals. If they didn’t accomplish this everything would be confiscated. No real individual ownersship can exist under such a dictatorial leadship and therefor no real freedom.
3. Collectivistic ideas which are actually shared between fascists and socialists. Totalitarian ideas. In the end both leads to an elite ruling class.
4. The party took control of the printing presses and created hyper inflation. Exactly like it works today with some other checks and balances. FIAT money for the people but the party hoarded gold and other resources for their own means. In response to this they did point 5.
5. The party set prices, wages and quoatas. This invariably leads to the existance of a black market being created if you infact don’t controll everything people do with spies etc. This invarbiable leads to shortages because of the intrinsic way the market and human nature works. Severe punishments must be dealt in such conditions “death penalty or labour camp” out to curve this otherwise people will not care about it being illegal. Can you see the similarities between Soviet Union and Germany? Since most of the world today are mixed economies “except Hong Kong and Shanghai?” we can see these traits in some regards even in our societies in for example our socialised medicine with waiting lines and shortages of services. Harsher punishment for tax evations and black market buying and selling then for example violent crimes. In Sweden for example it’s higly likely that you will get out of jail earlier for manslaughter then for evading paying your taxes. In Soviet Union and Germany these shortages and black market dealings held true in all bransches of society.
6. Due process takes to long time for society to curb these illegal tradings so by virtue the police/spies or whatever is given the ability to be the judge and executor with no means for the person to plead his case in a court of law. This can be seen in most countries where if you are prosecuted for certain crimes like for example tax evation “crime against the state” it’s up to you to proove you are innocent and not the other way around.
7. The only way out of this mess in the end was slave labour and the route to one of the darkest periods in the worlds history for jews, gypsies and other minorities. Soviet was much worse in numbers.
This is ofcourse when it goes to the extreme point of the spectrum and we are far from there now.
What scary to me is that it’s seems so easy for the state “the party” to promise to lead society down this path since the appeal to people seems to be that they don’t have to take any sort of responsibillity of their own lives. Not even in times of economic upturn goverments around the world refrains from bribing their populaces with subsidies, welfare etc. All historic facts show that more personal and economic freedom leads to a better society but still it seems so hard to persuade people to vote for such policies. Maybe democracy is the problem…
Certain politicians like Farage seems to be sniffing in the right direction but still has so many hurdles to get over. When politicians like die hard freedom lovers like Ron Paul shows up they are being labled as the anti-christ though their only goal is more personal and economic freedoms for everyone.
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