July 28, 2008 at 1:26 pm #54211
Below FYI is an email I received today regarding our development in Elvira.
“Some good news
The Town hall has agree with the regional Gov that the general plan that has been approved in Marbella can be activated.
Previously this would have to go to the reg gov by the year end, they would have to approve it and then by the time it comes back it would be after next year, at this point only could 1st Occ license be issued.
What has been agree is that the with the agreement of the Reg Gov Marbella can start immediately issuing 1st Occ license for those projects included, this included yours.”
Can’t find the article on the web but it’s in La Opinion de Malaga in the Municipios section 24th July
July 28, 2008 at 7:56 pm #85529
That’s great news Paul for all those who have completed on various developments but have been living with ‘uncertainty’. Hopefully this will also help those needing a mortgage but until now have been refused because of lack of the LFO – a big problem to many committed/having pressure from the developer to complete.
The question is where does that leave those with ongoing court cases based on the fact that many of these develpments were deemed illegal builds, but now suddenly an LFO is approved?
July 28, 2008 at 8:16 pm #85530
It does, as you know, depend on the development, some should sail through others may not be so quick. I don’t know which developments are now on the plan, no doubt others here will either know or speculate. I know many owners who have managed to get a mortgage on the developments in our area, even if there wasn’t an LFO and as you say this will make it easier.
I think it will be ‘bad’ news for those who are using the lack of a LFO as the only reason for not completing as it is now likely that the developers will win every case, again others more learned than I will have an answer. Those in this position may want to reassess their situation as the risk of litigation must be even greater than before.
I think it’s going to be messy for a while yet, but as you say good news for owners in developments like ours.
July 29, 2008 at 8:13 am #85536
good news for some, but if the courts don’t see the lack of LFO as a good enough reason for not completing, this will send messages that justice in Spain is still a joke and just can’t be relied on. Do they really expect people to complete on properties that could be in serious breach of contract or worse even?
July 29, 2008 at 9:23 am #85540
I think it will be ‘bad’ news for those who are using the lack of a LFO as the only reason for not completing as it is now likely that the developers will win every case…
I totally agree with your comments/observations. Would just like to add though that many cases are not just based on a lack of a LFO but also a revoked building licence, making the situation for these purchasers even more precarious when deciding whether to complete or go the litigation route.
To complete where there is no legal building licence in place, the consequent lack of LFO aside, is just one risk too far for many.
However, even in these cases the judges are finding for the developer so as far as Spanish justice is concerned, I totally give up.
* For those not aware of their rights, it goes against Spanish law to have to complete without a LFO, let alone not having a legal building licence in place.
But your rights within the law in Spain don’t count. You have been warned.
July 29, 2008 at 11:49 am #85548
Although (and i know this won’t go down well) i see the courts point, that if the developer had a licence and it can’t be proven that they were implicit in obtaining it illegally then the developer has built in good faith and the poor sod of a buyer is stuck. Be clear I am NOT saying this is correct i just see how one could come to this conclusion.
On the development i know about in Elvira, i understand pressure is being brought to bear on buyers who have not completed, but i am not aware of legal action by the developer on a buyer. As far as I’m aware it’s the only when a buyer tries to get a deposit back and fails the developer forces his hand. If I’m correct i would suggest that the developers are mindful of the risk of litigation as the buyers are. I do know that the developer is not paying community fees and this is making life very difficult for the owners who have completed.
Clearly the new plan is aimed at bring many if not all the developments on it back into legality. That is if they have a revoked licence, a new licence under the new plan will be issued and a if it conforms then a LFO will be granted. So your point to not complete without a LFO or licence is correct but academic.
The courts seem to be saying that the Town Hall not issuing LFO’s after it issued a licence is not a good enough reason to find against the developer. That is the developer is not to blame for Town Hall mismanagement (I know all of the arguments regarding corruption so please don’t repeat them.) As I’ve said this leaves the poor sod of a buyer stuck between a rock and a hard place. I would hope that if this report is correct when these properties are made legal people can then happily complete and take a load off.
I am surprised that that i was the first to bring this to the forum attention as it seems to be all over the papers down there!
July 29, 2008 at 12:04 pm #85549
Paul – thanks for the link, it all looks encouraging re. laying to rest the uncertainty surrounding many developments.
I was pleased to see the subject of compensation has also been addressed: The Town Hall’s proposal to prevent the compensation bills falling to the owners of illegal properties on developments that were already inhabited, was to find alternative land in the new PGOU so that the town would not lose out on public services. The compensation charges would still be imposed however on developers. In fact the Mayor herself recently reported that the criteria for the compensations system was “agreed and finalised”.
However, am wondering what will happen in the cases where the developer has either declared bankruptcy, is on the verge of doing so, or simply says they have no land/money to give. Many developers are already falling behind with their share of maintenance charges where they still own properties based on lack of funds/cash flow.
Whatever happens, certainly the purchasers should not be involved in any way in being responsible for paying compensation.
July 29, 2008 at 12:09 pm #85550
I quickly scanned an article in Diariosur last week. I don’t feel as positive about it as the person who sent you the first communication. Just sounded a bit of the same old to me. Not saying I am correct, just gut feeling, so I didn’t think it was worth posting.
July 29, 2008 at 12:24 pm #85551
Who knows in the case of compensation, like many others i suspect, I own no land to give as compensation so knocking at my door would be a waste of time 🙂
However, am wondering what will happen in the cases where the developer has either declared bankruptcy, is on the verge of doing so, or simply says they have no land/money to give. Many developers are already falling behind with their share of maintenance charges where they still own properties based on lack of funds/cash flow
Well if they have no assets then they can’t pay, if they are close to bankruptcy then they will go in to it, like all businesses I assume. There would be uproar if they tried to collect from thousands of owners.
I suspect there is still many buckets of smelly brown stuff waiting to hit the quickly rotating thing somewhere.
July 29, 2008 at 12:47 pm #85553
……so in some cases the developer pulls the plug, the innocent buyer looses everthing, and what’s the betting the developer will re-emerge with a different name/partner.
What a great system!
July 29, 2008 at 1:14 pm #85554
………..so in some cases the developer pulls the plug, the innocent buyer looses everything, and what’s the betting the developer will re-emerge with a different name/partner.
What a great system
I don’t know how we got to the above in this thread, but yes this happens all over the world. Without knowing the buyer story it hard to suggest what to do, but if its the lack of a licence or an LFO then complete the purchase if this news clears that up!
Anyway the news is there, make of it what you will, i’m happy for the many thousand owners it will help (including me), the many thousand buyers sitting on the fence who want to complete and now see light at the end of the tunnel and I’m sad for those who just want out and see this as bad news as it reduces their chances.
July 29, 2008 at 2:13 pm #85557
the point i’m making is the hopeless planning/regulation. If a decent system was in place to keep track of developments from the very start to finish, then these problems wouldn’t be on such a grand scale. Once again greed/corruption rules in Spain.
though good news for those lucky enough to be in a position to take advantage, many look like losing through no fault of their own….again!
July 29, 2008 at 2:44 pm #85558
I thought better of my original reply and deleted it.
my response is now:
Anyway the news is there, make of it what you will….
I sincerely hope you get your money back soon, for every ones sake and sanity.
July 29, 2008 at 4:15 pm #85560
thank you, and lets hope the many others cheated, also get justice. If our warnings help 1 person, then it’s worth it.
July 31, 2008 at 7:15 pm #85606
Good to hear nice things, and i still live in hope that justice will prevail one day, though while basking in your good fortune, please spare a thought for the growing army of honest people, that have done there homework, gone in to it with eyes open and are still being, well and truly ‘ripped off ‘ and any trust, shot pieces by crap agents and building companies!
Good news for some, but if the courts don’t see the lack of LFO as a good enough reason for not completing, this will send messages that justice in Spain is still a joke and just can’t be relied on. Do they really expect people to complete on properties that could be in serious breach of contract or worse even?
If I had the money I would pay myself 😉
Just Frank 8)
July 31, 2008 at 7:19 pm #85607
Unnecessary comment Frank 😕
August 2, 2008 at 10:46 am #85638
Further to this I heard on the Spanish news that the Junta has told Marbella Council that fast tracking the Town plan is not only for them to issue licences. Their (marbella) priority must be to demolish some of the buildings that are illegal. Mainly the ones where no-one is living there. It is also in Diario de malaga but haven’t had time to read through it (visitors 🙄 )
August 7, 2008 at 1:11 pm #85684
1000 applications for LFO’s have been received in a week!
August 7, 2008 at 4:10 pm #85685
Not surprising! I wonder how long it will take them to issue the LFO’s and how many. 1,000 ❓
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