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I was recently in Ibiza on business and just happened to view a property for sale that looked very interesting. I plan to pay cash but know NOTHING about the potential pitfalls of doing a deal there, or how it all differs from the deals we do here. Can anyone offer some guidelines please? The place is part of a small group of houses, some of which are already occupied.
I will be forever grateful!
Denman
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Hi Denman
@you wrote:
….. some of which are already occupied.
1. By that, do you mean it is a new development? If so, you or your lawyer must check with the Town Hall that there is an approved/valid building licence, and insist on seeing the Licence of First Occupation.
Many thousands of people are in trouble in Spain because they completed without one or both of these not being in place.2. Check to see if this group of houses share any form of maintenance or whether they are they all financially independent. Is the infrastructure (roads, street lighting etc.) already in place – if not, new residents may be required to chip in to pay for it.
3. It is worth finding out if the builder/developer is financially solid.
4. Katy’s advice is the most important re. the lawyer. It is imperative you get a totally independent one who has no connection whatsoever with the builder/developer or selling agent. Otherwise you may be in the position of paying him to look after your interests, but he will be more intent on looking after his mates… the developer and/or agent. One of the reasons the property market is in the mess it’s in is because of this backhander culture.
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Charlie, while I agree to everything you said to look for. Isn’t this what you are paying the lawyers to do for you.
While there is an argument for an independent Lawyer. As we have seen this does not mean anything. On the mainland one can perhaps do this. On an Island its difficult. As the net work of people are same who gets recycled time after time.
The lawyer that you employ will act for you once. However his interest will be towards the developer/s for future income stream.
By, having a UK contact will not mean anything as they will shift blame onto one another & the Law society will not be able to assist you. Whilst I was being ironical but dividing & ruling two layers is a further recipe for disaster.
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Juan Bertomeu (Iuris Consulting) covers Ibiza from Moraira, just a few hours away by boat. Everyone I know who has ever used him raves about him, and last time I checked he also charged the most reasonable legal fees I’ve come across. You can get his contact details from here:
Despite all the problems some people have had there are some really great lawyers in Spain, really decent professionals.
Mark
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@shakeel wrote:
Isn’t this what you are paying the lawyers to do for you.
In theory, yes Shakeel. However, in practice many of us including myself fell flat on our faces because even though we were paying our lawyers to do what is necessary to protect us, they didn’t. Unbeknown to us they were dinner-table buddies with the developer who fed each other clients.
That is why a good, honest, independant, recommended lawyer who will put your interests first and protect you all the way through the buying process is a must. Even if it means they go up against the developer and fight for what is necessary before you part with any money.
You are an experienced purchaser Shakeel and know all the pitfalls to look for – especially when it comes to the essential documents required and those ‘illegal contract clauses’ the Spanish love to insert to throw the bias their way. Not everyone is as savvy or knowledgable, we certainly weren’t despite having bought and sold houses in the UK.
Denman – you probably couldn’t do better than a recommended lawyer by Mark (the Administrator of this forum).
If anyone has his ear to the ground, he has…..and if it all goes wrong you know who to moan to. 😉Only kidding Mark.
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So right
Independent still does not mean the lawyer will do what you are paying him for – but he/she will charge you enough for the privilege! It may be they do not have the concept of extended duty of care so unless you specifically ask them to go the extra mile they will only complete on the transaction and say that’s what you asked them to do?
Another option which I often recommend is to try and find a dual qualified solicitor but I don’t know if there is one practising in Ibiza – that way if anything goes wrong report them to the law society or solicitors regulation authority.
But otherwise you have Mark’s recommendation which should be sound – but don’t forget it’s eyes wide open and all that glistens is not necessarily gold!
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@Denman wrote:
…..but know NOTHING about the potential pitfalls of doing a deal there, or how it all differs from the deals we do here.
Based on that comment, I would definitely find yourself a good lawyer.
I recommend this book: You and the Law in Spain by David Searle.
Don’t be put off by the title, it gives an excellent insight into the rights/wrongs/pitfalls of the buying procedure in Spain. It’s also very easy to read. -
Read up on the market before you make any move.
Prices are falling. Arguably the most reliable index around, Tinsa, is predicting a 20% drop this year alone. Most people expect the drop to continue into at least 2010.
Nothing wrong with buying now. Just factor this in to the price you pay. As a cash buyer you are in a VERY strong position at present.
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“You are an experienced purchaser Shakeel and know all the pitfalls to look for – especially when it comes to the essential documents required and those ‘illegal contract clauses’ the Spanish love to insert to throw the bias their way. Not everyone is as savvy or knowledgeable “
Charlie, It was perhaps 25% of what you posted. You could look for all the pitfalls & sundries, but when the whole system is geared up to fleecing people, than I think it was just a question of luck. I guess the one up in the sky was smiling at me.
Sadly in Spain “good faith ” does not work. You have to suspect everybody. It is for this reason that I & many that I know will not invest in Spain with a view to make a decent living creating economic activity & leaning & makings others learn in the process. Its sad reflection on a nation that I love so much.
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When I read how 18 of the 29 Mayors in the Axarquía area of Málaga are now under investigation for real estate irregularities, I’m coming to the conclusion that to restore some sort of confidence, the Junta should take away planning powers from this shoddy shower of corrupt snouts-in-the-trough piglets, and set up their own ‘Junta Office for Town Planning’ in every town hall – so any permissions are given with the authority straight from ‘the top’.
In the long run it must be cheaper to fund these offices than all these court cases and the ensuing financial/legal mess the current situation is creating.
There are many aspects of Spain that is a joke, the problem is it’s going to take some serious thinking and action to righten it.
Apologies Denman – have gone way off topic.
IBIZA, IBIZA, IBIZA.
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@katy wrote:
I saw on a Spanish forum today a comment
“Que cachondeo de pais” More or less, “Spain is a joke”
I do not know about living in Spain, but living in UK seems to be a constant joke these days.
Nobody knows what to do (at any level: my university level, my kids school level, my current landlord level, let alone Goveernment level).
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