- This topic has 28 replies, 12 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 2 months ago by
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It is a lovely Country & a big Country with stunning landscape etc. The problem is where does one buy. As a non Croat you will standout like a sour thumb. People are not used to foreignors & react in a unwelcoming manner.
The Area’s that are developed. The prices are very high. If I say they are higher than the South of France. I will not be wrong. This does not allow much appreciation in the near future, paper chase & feeding civil servents along the way in a language which most people have very little chance of learning. THe same goes for Monte Negro.
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The main reason inflation took off in Spain when she joined the euro was because interest rates were slashed overnight. So on the face of it if Croatia has interest rates significantly higher than the eurozone when she joins then yes you can expect prices to increase. However you’ll have to look into other factors as well to determine if it’s worth a shot.
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Inflation has allways been high in Spain. Before Spain joined the € the interest rates on average were around 15%. This will give you some idea as to what the rate must have been. As a tourist we did not feel the real impact during our few days spent there besides the peseta that we bought reflected this via the exchange rate.
In the case of Croatia, Montenegro, Bulgaria, Slovenia its the other factors that matters. If the buyer has a member of his family from those part of the world & can act as a first line of defence in dealing with the pleasent or unpleasent issues that arise on an adhock basis than one could consider.
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Property prices in Croatia are already on a main stream European level so unless you plan to spend a lot of time there any investment returns are likely to be modest at best. Poor winter climate compared to Spain and Portugal and relatively short summers.
Although the natural beauty of the country is attractive that’s where it ends in my view. Spend some time there and you will realise my meaning. 🙁 The coastal regions are also very popular with Germans who have pushed up values.
If you take the long view however with property investment and by that I mean up to 20 years then the return may well be justified but you could say that about almost anywhere. Even Spain 😯 -
Croatia is a couple of hours drive from Germany, its basically the closest seaside for a whole load of countries, including southern Poland, so high demand and prices. I’m looking at Bulgaria but there are no flights from Krakow and its an 18hour drive through Romania. Its actually much quicker to drive to Nice, in France.
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FYI, yesterday, at a gay pride march in Split, Croatia, there was a lot of violence. 100 were detained for throwing rocks and bottles at marchers. Seems like religious-fueled violence is still a part of life in Eastern Europe. I should add that the Pope visited Croatia just last week and lamented the ‘disintegration’ of the family (which is his very special way of bashing gays) and then he prayed at the tomb of Cardinal Stepinac, praising the Nazi-collaborator.
I know that this can happen anywhere, but I question the political stability of anyplace where the Vatican can easily ‘meddle’.
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The Balkans are probably two generations behind western Europe. You feel it everywhere you go in the region. Germans feel comfortable there because they spent sheds loads of money on holiday and are treated like princes by the population.
There is a tangible oppressive feeling travelling in the Balkans including Croatia.
You have to go there to understand it. I have read at length their history which hangs heavy in the air. -
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@GarySFBCN wrote:
FYI, yesterday, at a gay pride march in Split, Croatia, there was a lot of violence. 100 were detained for throwing rocks and bottles at marchers. Seems like religious-fueled violence is still a part of life in Eastern Europe. I should add that the Pope visited Croatia just last week and lamented the ‘disintegration’ of the family (which is his very special way of bashing gays) and then he prayed at the tomb of Cardinal Stepinac, praising the Nazi-collaborator.
I know that this can happen anywhere, but I question the political stability of anyplace where the Vatican can easily ‘meddle’.
Some may feel that you are using the topic of buying in Croatia to display your prejudices
Richard
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GarySFBCN: You called Cardinal Stepinac a Nazi-collaborator.
I suggest you read the comments of Winston Churchill regarding the Cardinal.
He used his position to protest in public at the risk of his own life over the nazi policy towards jews & gypsies. He also attacked the treatment of prisoners in concentration camps in Croatia.
He may have been many things but a collaborator he was not!
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@rt21 wrote:
Some may feel that you are using the topic of buying in Croatia to display your prejudices
RichardIt was in the news yesterday, and I thought it was pertinent to the discussion – who among expats and investors want to buy in an area that may lack civility or stability? And there are investors and expats who are gay and lesbian – do you not think that this may be important to them?
Finally, it is ironic that the Vatican constantly bashes gays and lesbians, but you are concerned about my prejudices. Get back to me about that when I am the head of an organization with 1.8 billion members.
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@GarySFBCN wrote:
FYI, yesterday, at a gay pride march in Split, Croatia, there was a lot of violence. 100 were detained for throwing rocks and bottles at marchers. Seems like religious-fueled violence is still a part of life in Eastern Europe. dle’.
The Balkans are not Eastern Europe, to a a large extent (genetically and culturally) they are Greek. But there is an certain amount of anti-gay prejudice in Poland as well and for the same reason, religious objection, from what is called Poland ‘B’ – the older, Eastern, poorer, rural, religious fanatics.
who among expats and investors want to buy in an area that may lack civility or stability?
Unfortunately that also covers most of southern Europe.
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@GarySFBCN wrote:
It was in the news yesterday, and I thought it was pertinent to the discussion – who among expats and investors want to buy in an area that may lack civility or stability? And there are investors and expats who are gay and lesbian – do you not think that this may be important to them?.
I think your comments on the violence against gays in Split were highly relevant and I would make clear that such behaviour is wrong and should rightfully be condemned. That was not the issue for me. It was the other language wrapped around it that I found so full of prejudice. “Seems like religious fuelled violence is still a part of life in Eastern Europe” “the Pope visited Croatia just last week and lamented the ‘disintegration’ of the family (which is his very special way of bashing gays) and then he prayed at the tomb of Cardinal Stepinac, praising the Nazi-collaborator.”. Although I appreciate that you have subsequently admitted that your comments about Cardinal Stepinac were mistaken, could I ask what evidence you have for stating that the attacks on the gay parade seems like religious fuelled violence. It seemed to me that the whole tone of your post was dripping with prejudice against the church. I could go on but I simply do not have the time to elaborate more on your post
@GarySFBCN wrote:
Finally, it is ironic that the Vatican constantly bashes gays and lesbians, but you are concerned about my prejudices. Get back to me about that when I am the head of an organization with 1.8 billion members.
If the Head of the Vatican had made a post on this thread in which he had singularly made derogatory remarks about gays I would have had no hesitation in sending the same post to him. However, that was not the case. It was you that posted the message not him. That is why my message was aimed you
Lastly the only irony I see in your two posts is that you mention the Pope bashing gays and yet your post seems to be aimed at bashing him and the church
Richard
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@rt21 wrote:
If the Head of the Vatican had made a post on this thread in which he had singularly made derogatory remarks about gays I would have had no hesitation in sending the same post to him. However, that was not the case. It was you that posted the message not him. That is why my message was aimed you
RichardThere are many examples on ‘his’ website, here is one – after you arrive on the Vatican’s page linked below, search on the word ‘violence’ :
And the two English-language articles I read about the violence in Croatia both discussed that Pope had visited Croatia the prior week and made yet another ‘disintegration of the family’ speech, and presumably, the authors thought it to be a pertinent fact to the story. As a rule, I do not keep up with the Pope’s travels.
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with all due respect to your post what I was seeking was evidence for you stating that the attacks on the gay parade seems like religious fuelled violence. It would appear, from what you are now saying, that your comments were largely influenced by two english language articles. Would you please provide links to those articles so that I can appreciate the rationale of your previous comments
Richard
The reason why I am keen to see the articles is that I want to satisfy myself that they are from bone fide sources and not from publications that are embellishing stories in order to promote a certain agenda
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@rt21 wrote:
with all due respect to your post what I was seeking was evidence for you stating that the attacks on the gay parade seems like religious fuelled violence. It would appear, from what you are now saying, that your comments were largely influenced by two english language articles. Would you please provide links to those articles so that I can appreciate the rationale of your previous comments
Richard
The reason why I am keen to see the articles is that I want to satisfy myself that they are from bone fide sources and not from publications that are embellishing stories in order to promote a certain agendaLet’s pause and assess for a moment.
1. Someone posted about Croatia (which I though was odd on a ‘Spanish Property’ blog).
2. Having just read about the anti-gay violence in Split, I responded, discussing the violence, and that the Pope (who is anti-gay) was visiting just the week before, etc. All of this I gleaned from the 1st article I read. I thought it added to the discussion for the reasons I stated: Instability and incivility.
3. You then proposed that what I wrote was to ‘display my prejudices.’
4. Others here have posted on this same thread that some homophobia is related to religion.
5. Now you are demanding that I produce the articles because you are concerned about a ‘certain agenda.’ What is this code? Can you not just come out and say what you are talking about? What’s all of this ‘some people’ and ‘certain agenda’ manner of communication?Let me make a guess: I suspect that somehow you perceive that the article’s association of religion with violent homophobia makes it ‘biased.’ If that is true, you lack the skill to determine proportionality.
Maybe this cartoon will help you understand:
http://js-kit.com/blob/J83x1eHlmo_A3N7HEgSRx4.jpg
Anyway, I won’t be posting any more on this Croatia thread. You can use Google to find the articles. There are at least two of them. I don’t know if they are credible sources, but one of them was linked to video of the violence. And I know all too well that religion is the cause of most of the world’s homophobia. It’s no secret.
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“1. Someone posted about Croatia (which I though was odd on a ‘Spanish Property’ blog). “
You are getting even more off topic now. As for the pope, if he makes speach’s against the ‘disintegration of the Family’, well that his right isn’t it? If he is anti-Gay, so what, you are obviously anti-Catholic. Who’s right?
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I was rather hoping for a pros/cons of buying in Croatia versus Spain type of discussion. We often make comparisons between the property markets in Spain with the USA and UK, so don’t see the difference really.
Katy, my nephew bought in Croatia years ago (on one of the little islands off the mainland, can’t remember where exactly). Has been returning every year eversince with his family, absolutely loves it. Often talks about the overwhelming friendliness of the people and the stunning unspoilt villages/towns/countryside. Still hasn’t cracked the language though. 😆
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Gary
This morning I had started to draft a detailed response to your latest note, which I intended posting this lunchtime.
However, I quess much to the relief of other forum members who simply wish to discuss the merits of buying property in Spain and other regions I have decided not to do this.
If you wish to burden yourself (and others) with the baggage of anti catholicism then so be it.
Richard
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@katy wrote:
Gary you said
“Someone posted about Croatia(which I thought was odd on a Spanish property blog)”
Not as odd as all the crap which followed 🙄 Twas only a discussion point…wished I hadn’t bothered. 😈
just shows you should not be anti-spain!
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@katy wrote:
Another one lost the plot. The quality of posts on here drops daily. What relevance is “anti Spain” (whatever that is 🙄 ) got to do with Croatia. FYI I was not even considering buying in Croatia, just interested in what people thought. Judging by the posts they are all on waccy baccy.
urgh.
it was an attempt at humour, nothing more, nothing less -
Croatia is allready expensive. Still don’t know why. Always was. I don’t like myself this kind of country. The property low is also not so well regulated. Now rumour up to 2013 they will be in EU.
But there is no climat, like Spain, coast is nice, but this is a still that terrible postcommunist atmosphere.
Well some people may like it….
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