March 26, 2010 at 7:14 am #55503
I don’t work these days, but recently I have considered starting up a small business in Spain.
It seems like Spain could do with some entrepreneurial activity, to help the economy. Yet as far as I can see the system here is quite unhelpful. I would have to start as an autonomo, and commit to paying around 250€ a month in taxes. This doesn’t seem too attractive to me, as I may not make any real cash for a couple of years.
In the UK there was (when I did this before) support to encourage new small businesses, but does similar support exist here? If not, I guess that explains why so many people work “cash in hand”.
March 26, 2010 at 2:19 pm #97679
Only if you have a lot of money to invest in the business in the first place, are female or long term unemployed…then you can apply for a grant but it has soo many strings attached that it really is not worth it unless you are opening a big business.
I have a labour contract for a small no of hrs and due to this (according to my hacienda/ social security office) can earn upto 651.33€ a month (if I remember of the top of my head correctly) without having to register as autonomia UNLESS I need to raise an invoice. Apparently, the hacienda are not interested in those earning little!
If you are only likely to need to raise an invoice once or twice a year, you can register for only the hacienda and not pay the 251€ a month social security. But this needs to be considered on a one to one basis by your hacienda etc. Obviously, with both, you do not get any sickness cover, pension etc etc.
The system definitely encourages people to work illegally, and no doubt this skews the unemployment figures as well.
March 28, 2010 at 11:13 am #97706
heatherpsk,well that’s news to me ! my understanding of the law was that it is illegal to do any sort of work without paying social security! Whereabouts are you based ? I shall have to enquire again as the gestoria I spoke to was adamant that you have to pay, full stop & the only low rate is for people who do cleaning work for multiple properties & few hours.
March 28, 2010 at 10:06 pm #97708
The best place for advice is the “Ventanilla Unica” of your local “camera comercial”…it was they that told me the above so if its wrong don’t blame me!!
I am paying into the system, as I have a labour contract but was asking whether I needed to become autonomia as I do a few private classes etc and that was the advice I was given..not until I am earning 651.33 or need to raise an invoice..one day I might get organised enough to earn that much but with 3 young children….
May 13, 2010 at 4:56 pm #98563
Spain and starting a business !!!!!!!!!!!!! You better give the start up money to charity and do a good deed & avoid a lot of pain & frustration.
Every step you will be asked to pay for something or the other, dont expect anything to be done and if done the level or quality will be poor and untimely.
May 13, 2010 at 5:16 pm #98564
Shakeel, your pointless negativity is rather tiresome. We have all heard your constant unsubstantiated moaning generalisations, and understand your postition clearly.
This thread was about starting businesses, not boring us with anti-Spain spam. 👿
May 28, 2010 at 5:26 pm #98778El anciano wrote:Shakeel, your pointless negativity is rather tiresome. We have all heard your constant unsubstantiated moaning generalisations, and understand your postition clearly.
This thread was about starting businesses, not boring us with anti-Spain spam. 👿
I can see where Shakeel was coming from. Starting a business in Spain is fact, similar to entering a minefield. Costs are high, if you want to open a shop or office usually a plan of the premises has to be drawn up, but it must be done by a “tecnico”, cost about 500 euros. Then umpteen forms have to be lodged with the town hall, Social Security , Hacienda etc. Plus high rental values. Help from government is almost nil, if one is prepared to run around for about three days obtaining this permission and that permission ,plus all the additional costs mentioned the princely sum of about 4,000 euros may be forthcoming. The photocopying bill will be quite high too. Plus treatment for a slipped disc due to the weight of carrying the paperwork around all the government departments.
Additionally the old bill will probably be around trying to place a fine on the unsuspecting entrepreneur as soon as he opens the door to give the place a clean.
I may be following Shakeel in being negative but this is how it is, I have just helped someone set up a business, IT IS VERY HARD WORK.
However so as not to be accused of negativity Really good news ,after years of abuse , autonomos,self employed, people, will soon be able to claim the paro(dole), for periods depending on how long they have contributed to the Social Security, at last they will or can receive something for their 250 euros each month.
May 29, 2010 at 5:45 am #98785
Having lived in Spain for a number of years, I no longer consider the bureaucracy to be problem that so many complain of. Sure it’s time consuming, and at times frustrating. But I live here, there comes a time when you have to accept that you live in Spain, and complaining about the system is just futile.
There is also the strong suggestion that a new venture is just a waste of time & money, but this is clearly not the case. There are many successful businesses running in Spain. It’s seems to me that the very nature of a start-up will always include paperwork, and overcoming issues, and cost money.
BTW, what alternatives would you suggest it’s not as though it possible for someone living in Spain to sensibly consider starting up a venture in another country. Maybe you are advocating just sitting in the house watching British TV, or working in a tourist bar 🙂
Don’t misunderstand me, I’m well aware of the issues with fees, delays, and local police fines. The assumption in both yours & Shakeel’s post seems to assume that I am “straight of the boat”. This is not the case.
Thanks for the information, but nonetheless this thread is about incentives. There is a tendency on this forum for some members to post moaning & mostly irrelevant responses to many of the topics. In this case I simply don’t see the need to post disincentives in a topic about incentives, I’m sure it’s a cheap form of therapy, but I’m not a psychotherapist.
May 29, 2010 at 8:30 am #98791
as they say when in rome.
i had the same problem as you, but after a very short time you concede that you live in spain and do it there way.
which in fact if you let it go over your head is better for you, and not so stressful.
May 29, 2010 at 9:22 am #98792
Anciano you could try a trawl through this site
Beware companies offering to advise how to get grants. They charge upfront….now and again they appear on the CDS. They are scams.
May 29, 2010 at 9:28 am #98793
June 7, 2010 at 10:36 am #98947
I know many foreigners (British and French mainly) who successfully started businesses in Spain as “Autonomos”, especially in the IT/software industry (in Spain the market is less saturated and you will have less competition than in other countries).
They just pay for social security only the month they are invoicing a client (and they “switch-off” the activity in between). It’s a practice on the borderline of legality, but since they are working from home, they are less visible than a shop or a restaurant
What they told me is that in this downturn period, clients are paying late… and this is particularly hard in Spain since you have to pay the VAT at the end of the quarter. If the client didn’t pay yet, you are forced to pay the VAT upfront.
June 14, 2010 at 7:33 am #99074
“Shakeel, your pointless negativity is rather tiresome. We have all heard your constant unsubstantiated moaning generalisations, and understand your postition clearly.”
I am sorry if you find it tiresome & negative. There are a lot of members who may not have looked at a certain aspect of life in Spain plus new members. I rather they find it tiresome & negative than loose their money, time, effort & energy. Not everything in life can be
substainted but that does not mean it does not exist.
Yes, in Rome do as the Romans do. No unlike others I do not watch English TV only, in fact I watch both, further I do speak Spanish & made an effort to go to a University in Spain.
Spain is a country to enjoy life not to work and if one can manage & throw money at problems than this is great. There may be people running so called successful businesses. One has to ask How much start up capital was required, Number of hours put it. What was their take home at the end of the month, how much more it would have been if so many mouths did not have to be fed who had not contributed to ones bottom line on the contrary they have been an obstacle and while one is working their guts off the mouth that one has fed is having his beer on the beach.
Some, Countries have the policy of encouraging business others dont & Spain is in the later category. The fact that the majority of Spaniards wants to work as civil servants the black economy is probably as big as the main economy and there 20% unemployment substantiate my argument
I, love Spain passionately. However we have to call spade a spade and until we dont face reality we are deceiving ourselves & my so called negative comments are the reality in a harsh world. People can take it or leave. I let other people take you to the rose garden. The Cactus garden is more prickly & people need to tread with care.
The forum ‘Property Questions & Answers’ is closed to new topics and replies.