what is an urbanisation?

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This topic contains 17 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Anonymous Anonymous 10 years, 3 months ago.

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  • #51993
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Our urbanisation was built in a number of phases, now complete.
    We bought into the ‘middle phase’.
    The Statutes (that we signed in front of the Notario) state that all phases are legally one urbanisation and contain various rules and regulations.
    However, there are now three Communidads. One for the phase prior to ours. Then ours, and now the latest (and biggest) phase.

    Is this correct and legal? There are already some areas of disagreement and differing interests between these three organisations.
    Do the Statutes over-ride the three individual Community Rules?
    Are these more ‘informal’ rules actually enforceable?

  • #63571
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I’m on our community committee so while no expert I have an understanding I think. You should first look at the Horizontal law which if you pm me your email address I’ll send you the English version I have. You also have a copy of the statutes which will tell you to which buildings, blocks or phases the statutes apply (ours do.) If it names all of the three phases then I would think that all of them belong to one community with one elected president and one elected or appointed administrator (the president can be both.) Have you had an AGM yet, something you must have ever year? The thing to remember is that as an owner you own a share of the community and therefore have a right to know everything that goes on in that community.

    I bought a book called “You and the Law in Spain” to quote Amazon “The Complete and Readable Guide to Spanish Law for Foreigners (Including Horizontal Law in English)” by David Searl which I found very helpful with all matters relating to the Spanish system.

    The community “Rules” should be based on the statutes and therefore enforceable if not based on them then not enforcable. Depends on the rules really, if you don’t pay your community fees, the president can ask the AGM for permission to take you to court and ask for seizure of your property and then sell it to recover the community charge. Getting someone to take down the towels from the terrace is trickier, no matter what the statutes say!

    Paul

  • #63572
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    ok many thanks p800aul for your reply.
    In fact . . .
    I do have a translation of the Horizontal Law, and a copy of You and the Law in Spain, so I’m pretty au fait with the whole Communidad thing.

    My query really concerns the relationship between the Statutes document, which we signed when purchasing, and the three communities and their Rules, when the Statutes document says that the whole is one urbanisation, not three.
    Just what is this Statutes document. What’s it for?

  • #63573
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I would check with your lawyer, but i would think looking at the book and the Law that if the Statutes clearly state that all of the three phases are one community then that what they should be. The statutes are the laws of the community and i would guess by signing them you agreed to join the community and abide by them.

    To change the statutes needs ALL of the owners 100% to agree at the AGM or EGM. The Rules should come from the statutes, ours for example says don’t hang anything over the terrace, awnings must be of a certain colour, no satellite dishes etc etc. so we have them as rules.

    Paul

  • #63584
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Statutes are the ‘Law’ of a Community, everything stated there unless modified by the 100% of present proprietors is what really counts.

    Although big Communities usually create ‘sub-communities’ as Day-to-day relationships of owners are best ruled this way, you must be aware that most of decisions taken could be void if affecting the whole community or even common areas or services as the only way to take them is in a whole community meeting.

    Cesar

  • #63817
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @nickstrong wrote:

    Our urbanisation was built in a number of phases, now complete.
    We bought into the ‘middle phase’.
    The Statutes (that we signed in front of the Notario) state that all phases are legally one urbanisation and contain various rules and regulations.
    However, there are now three Communidads. One for the phase prior to ours. Then ours, and now the latest (and biggest) phase.

    Is this correct and legal? There are already some areas of disagreement and differing interests between these three organisations.
    Do the Statutes over-ride the three individual Community Rules?
    Are these more ‘informal’ rules actually enforceable?

    All owners/buyers of Spanish property should buy and read this book; http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/8489954321/026-7916391-8364434?v=glance&n=266239 “You and the Law in Spain: The Complete and Readable Guide to Spanish Law for Foreigners”

  • #63627
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @nickstrong wrote:

    Our urbanisation was built in a number of phases, now complete.
    We bought into the ‘middle phase’.
    The Statutes (that we signed in front of the Notario) state that all phases are legally one urbanisation and contain various rules and regulations.
    However, there are now three Communidads. One for the phase prior to ours. Then ours, and now the latest (and biggest) phase.

    Is this correct and legal? There are already some areas of disagreement and differing interests between these three organisations.
    Do the Statutes over-ride the three individual Community Rules?
    Are these more ‘informal’ rules actually enforceable?

    All owners/buyers of Spanish property should buy and read this book; http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/8489954321/026-7916391-8364434?v=glance&n=266239 “You and the Law in Spain: The Complete and Readable Guide to Spanish Law for Foreigners”

  • #63853
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Yes, as I’ve said, I have the book and agree with you; it’s very useful (and readable).
    It doesn’t, however, address the precise question I’m asking.
    Which is why I’m asking it.

  • #63653
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Yes, as I’ve said, I have the book and agree with you; it’s very useful (and readable).
    It doesn’t, however, address the precise question I’m asking.
    Which is why I’m asking it.

  • #63858
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi

    I’m intrigued Nick do you currently have a community President, or 3 Presidents?

    Has there been an AGM?

    Do you have a professional administrator (or 3) or is it an owner?

    regards

    Paul

  • #63658
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi

    I’m intrigued Nick do you currently have a community President, or 3 Presidents?

    Has there been an AGM?

    Do you have a professional administrator (or 3) or is it an owner?

    regards

    Paul

  • #63864
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Within the wider urbanisation (the various phases contained in it and mentioned in the single Statutes document) there are three Communidads and three Presidents (and three sets of Community Rules). Our phase happens to have the same Administrator as the first phase Communidad – I’m not sure about the situation for the final phase/Communidad.
    There are also (!) inter-Communidad fees and charges for use of the various facilities (i.e swiming pools) contained in each phase, but available for use by the entire Urbanisation.
    Bit of a mess, it seems to me. And unclear as to where authority and responsibility ultimately lies (I am familiar with conventional single Community obligations, rules, procedures – but what happens within the context of one Urbanisation/Statutes that contains three Communidads?).
    But the phases took about three years to complete, so I guess the occupiers of the first (fairly modest) phase shouldn’t have had to wait until completion of the last for their community rules.

    PS (edit) oh yes, and three AGMs

  • #63664
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Within the wider urbanisation (the various phases contained in it and mentioned in the single Statutes document) there are three Communidads and three Presidents (and three sets of Community Rules). Our phase happens to have the same Administrator as the first phase Communidad – I’m not sure about the situation for the final phase/Communidad.
    There are also (!) inter-Communidad fees and charges for use of the various facilities (i.e swiming pools) contained in each phase, but available for use by the entire Urbanisation.
    Bit of a mess, it seems to me. And unclear as to where authority and responsibility ultimately lies (I am familiar with conventional single Community obligations, rules, procedures – but what happens within the context of one Urbanisation/Statutes that contains three Communidads?).
    But the phases took about three years to complete, so I guess the occupiers of the first (fairly modest) phase shouldn’t have had to wait until completion of the last for their community rules.

    PS (edit) oh yes, and three AGMs

  • #63865
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    You would think that one community is the way forward with a vice president in each phase. What does your administrator say about it?

    I would think there would be savings to be made by just having one community, i mean the AGM meeting room cost us 1000 euros.

    Regards

    Paul

  • #63665
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    You would think that one community is the way forward with a vice president in each phase. What does your administrator say about it?

    I would think there would be savings to be made by just having one community, i mean the AGM meeting room cost us 1000 euros.

    Regards

    Paul

  • #64213
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    What is the Spanish for Community Statutes please?

    Would everyone expect to receive a detailed annual report complete with details of income and expenditure?

    If no financial details are readily available how can these be obtained?

    Christian

  • #65342
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Christian,

    You should be looking for something called “Los Estatutos de la Comunidad” for your community.

    You should receive a complete breakdown of the running costs of the community, how much has been spent, how much has been collected from the owners, and how much and who owes money to the community.

    This set of accounts must be produced for each AGM. If the community is new the administrator should prepare a budget for the first year.

    The first start would be the president of your community who should tell you who are the administrators for the community. The president should really have the statutes and the bugdet for the community and should willingly hand them over.

    Best wishes

    Bernard

  • #65369
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    The president should really have the statutes and the bugdet for the community and should willingly hand them over.

    As for the Statutes you could / should find that you agreed to abide by them when you signed your Title Deed

    Regards

    Paul

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