The arrogant face of corruption

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This topic contains 36 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of katy katy 9 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #53016
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    Anonymous
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    It seems almost daily now we are reading more stories on corruption, the latest regarding corrupt judges and Aifos being just one of many showing how deep-rooted this corruption is in Spain.
    The continuing saga of Juan Martin Serón, the recently re-elected Mayor of Alhaurin el Grande who is still protesting his innocence re. corruption really typifies the open arrogance that these people show for the rule of law and respect for decency when holding an office of power.

    A police report just published on the case says that the Mayor and his town planning councillor, Gregorio Guerra, charged a fixed rate of 6,000 € commission for every extra illegal dwelling built in the town, and 80 € per square metre when building was greater than authorised.
    La Opinion de Málaga has printed the transcripts of phone conversations between the Town Planning Councillor and local builders, speaking clearly about the demands for ‘extra’ payments.

    When about 200 local people accompanied the Mayor in a protest at arrests of local builders/developers recently, now we know why. They all had 6,000 € ‘investments’ to protect.

    The money was collected via payments made to a local businessman, Manuel M.M. from the Conextran company, linked to the Mayor’s wife.
    No wonder Conextran’s website states: “We have all the requirements necessary to execute any work that one wishes with the security that we will obtain its approval”. 😉

    Why is this man still sitting in his Mayor’s chair instead of being arrested…..along with his wife?
    In my view they, and Gregorio Guerra, are no better than Rocca and Yague.

  • #73480
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Just to add that at least things are beginning to move re. Town Hall officials and judges.
    Still waiting for media exposure of corruption/arrests regarding corrupt REA’s, lawyers and developers (Aifos are not the only ones). All of whom I am sure have been involved in bribes.
    There are at least five professions in this ‘marriage’!

  • #73482
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    Just to add that at least things are beginning to move re. Town Hall officials and judges.
    Still waiting for media exposure of corruption/arrests regarding corrupt REA’s, lawyers and developers (Aifos are not the only ones). All of whom I am sure have been involved in bribes.
    There are at least five professions in this ‘marriage’!

    regarding bolded.
    Won’t happen, all the large corrupt ones are going bust (according to some recent rumours). And these ‘people’ won’t stay in spain. They’re like locusts. Devastate then more on.

  • #73485
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    …Still waiting for media exposure of corruption/arrests regarding corrupt REA’s, lawyers and developers…

    Media exposure was exactly what the Action thread was working towards, which has been removed. I don’t think that waiting is going to work quickly enough for most of us.

    For any who would like to sign Our Petition & add to the Lawyer Complaints Document which details & names these corrupt lawyers you can here:
    http://www.spanishpropertyscandalpetition.co.uk

  • #73487
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Unfortunately, petitions do not always ‘work quickly’ either, as with the Land Grab petition.

    In the recent MEP report concerning the Land Grab situation, Michal Cashman said:

    “This issue was brought to the attention of the Committee on Petitions in 2003. Back then, 15 000 citizens wrote to us asking for help. What have we done? Well, we have adopted the Fourtou report, which brought forward a series of recommendations to the Valencian Government. The Valencian Government brought forward minor changes in the LUV, which do not address the key problems of land grab”.

  • #73497
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    The end of the Report of 21/06/07 quoted above states;

    ‘The Commission is unhappy. It believes that possible infringements of EU law are under way. Therefore, I say this: to do nothing is not an option, we have exhausted what we can do in this House and this will be resolved in the Court of Justice or before the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg, and it will be to the shame of the Partido Popular in Spain.”
    No, General Petitions do not ‘work quickly’ but they certainly can do a lot towards compiling evidence that is extremely valuable.

  • #73499
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Charlie, you are right of course but you have to start some where ,and the beginning is normally that point , the fact is that huge numbers of people have been monumentally wronged who need a rallying point ,already this week I have passed onto SPSP 5 people who have really quite distressing property issues ,these people fall outside the normal support groups that already exist, it is for these folk and countless others like them that SPSP is so important ,it may not be perfect right now but I suspect that AUN and others have adapted and grown as their situation has unfolded.

    You are more than aware that nothing happens quickly in Spain ,indeed all legal process’s take time, I think this is the case here, a truly brilliant start has been made ,I feel it would be disingenuous not to allow people a platform whereby fears views and information can be exchanged on a subject by subject basis Hopefully with the continued support of all the superb contributors on the Forum SPSP can continue to develop and perform that vital function of helping to progress the much needed legal reform that is at the heart of so many problems that are being uncovered on a daily basis/

  • #73503
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    Unfortunately, petitions do not always ‘work quickly’….

    @suzanne wrote:

    No, General Petitions do not ‘work quickly’….

    @GSB wrote:

    You are more than aware that nothing happens quickly in Spain ,indeed all legal process’s take time, I think this is the case here….

    All in agreement then. 😀

  • #73510
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Returning to topic….

    Following on from the revelations yesterday from the police report in the Alhaurín el Grande corruption case:
    La Opinion de Málaga has just published that the Town Planning Councillor, Gregorio Guerra, even asked a builder for a 121,000 € in commission on the very same day that he was arrested. The builder has come forward and denounced the demand made for the modification of a building licence.

    The paper says that the judge in Instruction Court 2 in Coín hearing the case, actually has a tape recording of that meeting. (I love that bit, maybe lesson-learnt – we should all carry a voice-recorder in Spain).

    So the 6000€ per illegal licence was just their ‘bread & butter’ money then. 😯

  • #73524
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Charlie, Thank you for confirming your support this is surprising but most welcome as you are after all the forum “”Meister” and your views are held in high esteem , you are no doubt aware the Action thread was this Forum’s most successful with a truly huge audience and a massive following ,completely dwarfing all the other threads both in the number of contributors and in terms of postings ,from memory some 21000 ,the amount of information that this thread contained was substantial and necessary it would be a crime if this important community based data base were to migrate to another web site ,after all the hard work that has gone into providing a platform of support and information for those that are struggling to find an independent source of information free from influence from out side sources

  • #73525
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant


    I really don’t know what you are trying to infer here Gary.

    This is not the Action thread (which I always supported), this thread is about exposing the ‘Arrogant face of corruption’.
    May I suggest if there had not been so much support on the Action thread for an individual who persisted in personal attacks, it would not have degenerated
    in the way it did which resulted in it being temporarily removed.

    I politely recommend you address any grievances that the Action thread has not been restored yet to Mark, the Administrator of the forum.
    Its continual absence has nothing to do with me or, might I add, this particular thread.

  • #73563
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    How would you like to vote yourself a huge pay rise out of tax-payers money?
    The Mijas Mayor did, ending up with a wage of 126,000 euros. That’s more than the Spanish Prime Minister!

    Now the elections are over, across the country, local Mayors have awarded themselves an average an increase of 30% – despite many Town Halls being ‘strapped for cash’.
    Mayors of Spain……get real!
    (At least the Mayor of Mijas has been ‘encouraged to resign’ over his greed).

    http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_11502.shtml

  • #73565
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Much like in UK then, where a Council Leader gets paid more that the PM.
    Nothin new in local politicians earning more that National, whatever the Country.
    What is the salary of the Mayor of London and the PM?

  • #73572
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi mg – good point, one I hadn’t really thought about.
    I managed to check re. Council leaders in Scotland and found that they are on between 26,000-45,000 pounds (depending what tax band their area is in!) but can’t seem to find any current data for England, though am sure you’re right and C.L.’s are on a higher salary in England.

    Salary of the Mayor of London and the PM?
    Yes, our dear Ken is way above the PM at 137,579 pounds this year. But surely one can’t compare the responsibilities of the Mayor of London to that of the Mayor of Mijas?
    Would be interesting to compare the Mayor of Madrid’s salary with that of Zapatero to see if there is the same discrepancy as in UK.

    The main point I was trying to make in my post is that it seems in Spain the Mayor himself can just pluck a figure out of the sky and award himself his/her payrise.
    Even Ken’s salary is dictated by a Review Board which then has to be approved by the Government.

    The Spanish Mayors’ payrises since the elections, averaging about 30% across the country, is surely a high % jump by anyone’s standards?

  • #73573
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    however bad things are the UK with regards to corruption, local government etc, i don’t think they are even a fraction of what’s been going on in Spain. These recent revelations about Aifos, judges, town halls etc, and now the ridiculous self given wage increases out of all proportion for mayors, show what a joke it is even comparing the two nations, when it comes to corruption and justice for those who deserve it, good or bad. And as has been said, is this the tip of the iceburg? Heaven knows what might come out when those who are being paid to keep quiet start singing?

  • #73595
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Roca could face nine years in prison.

    Looks like the ‘arrogant face of corruption’ will get their comeuppance for all the misery they have caused.

    http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_11543.shtml

  • #73596
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Nine years is not enough. It should be atleast 30 years depending on his age and confiscation of all his and his family assets. The family where their was proof that cash/goods etc has benefitted the family.

  • #73598
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Totally agree Shakeel. I certainly think the enormous amounts of money involved should have a bearing on the sentence. The amount Roca ‘squirreled away’ was not just a few million. It was greed and corruption at horrendous levels.

  • #73599
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    In todays Diario Sur…Judge Torres says that Roca’s fortune is at least 120 million euros.

  • #73601
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant


    An original painting by Joan Miró, in one of Juan Antonio Roca’s bathrooms

    Roca is known to have invested millions in paintings and other items. Not bad for a bloke with a job in the Town Hall.

    But confiscating Roca’s personal assets? Oh that would be so cruel Shakeel!
    Maybe they’ll allow him to keep the Miró to hang in his cell?

  • #73603
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    The €120m, will give him around €14M per each year of prison. I will be happy to forgo my 9 years of life or that kind of yearly reward.

    You may think what you like. The man had culture to have Miro, unlike Jesus Gill the late Mayor of Marbella who was as ow life as you could get. I have heard him speaking on TV.

    Shame, Roca did not respect the condensation/evaporation would damage/destroy a master piece if it happens to be a real Miro.

    To bo honest it may not even be the genuine article, people around him knew what he was upto and have probebly passed a fake knowing that he would not be taken the matter further apart from sending the heavies.

    Have been so judgemental on him. I forget that a lot if not all could have come from his lottery winning. The apart of €120m, is small feed if you look at the amount from Algordo

  • #73604
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Charlie, I have a feeling that his cell mate will not
    be so cultured.

  • #73608
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Am not so sure Shakeel.
    The way things are going, Roca could have a judge for a cell-mate.
    😀

  • #73609
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Perhaps in such a learned company they Roca & the judges can learn from another.

  • #73610
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Can just imagine the conversation:
    “What? You paid eleven million for your Monet?? You were done mate. I got mine for seven”.

  • #73614
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    How bad or good is relative. It is that most people in UK do not come accross the corruption at their level of daily life.

    The difference is Spain, Italy, France etc the situation is on your face In Uk it is done with more subtlety or shall we say through off shore company net work.

  • #73624
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    shakeel

    but that’s the point!, it’s everyday life that concerns the majority of people. How many people in the UK would doubt that a lawyer is working in their favour? How many people would not be confident that if a house that they were having built was falling apart, or nothing like original plans, they would end up getting justice without having to face crooks in a long an expensive court battle? Well i’ll tell you, not many!!! Please stop trying to say there is any comparison. Spains lack of regulation and it’s justice system is a corrupt bloody mess, have a look at Suzannes evidence if you want proof. I know the UK is a long way from perfect, but on property legal issues that the average guy in the street is concerned with, it looks likes heaven!

  • #73628
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Goodstich:
    I fully agree with mostly what you say. Further I am not sugguesting that there is Utopia any where in the world. It for this reason that I used the word relative.

    I have many friends in UK, who are lawyers and have bought & sold in UK. I have experiecend/heard incomptence, backhanders etc,etc, which an average buyers would not even have a snif off as to what was going on or had been going on behind the scence. The reason for this is that we in Uk are brought up to beleive that lawyers, accountants, judges are to be trusted and are held in high esteem and as a result they dont get challenged.

    The said professions, I would not trust and I am accountant and my late father was a lawyer.

    My reason for posting is that the forum seams to give the impression that we are squeeky clean in UK. I just want the readers to be aware that greed and corruption is everywhere and people have to apply extreme caution and prudence where ever they are and understand the working of a Country before placing their life saving/dream into some elses hands

  • #73631
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    shakeel wrote

    ”The reason for this is that we in Uk are brought up to beleive that lawyers, accountants, judges are to be trusted and are held in high esteem and as a result they dont get challenged.”

    ……….in my opinion they do get challenged, and because of public exposure, shame/penalties handed out if they are proved bent, then the majority of good ones are rightly held in high esteem. There have been many cases where people in these proffesions in the UK have been exposed and kicked out. There will always be bad eggs anywhere, but it’s the action taken against them that seems to be so different between the UK and Spain, and because of that, i think people on the whole in the UK feel they can at least trust and expect common sense from those who are working for them or handing out justice. Obviously there are many exceptions to this as the ‘rough justice’ series pointed out, but it’s not considered virtually ‘normal’ behavior, or on anything like such a grand scale as in Spain!

    It’s such a shame, Spain’s a lovely country with lovely people, but seems to be choked with poor regulation, poor local government, poor justice and greed. Just hope for the genuine people of Spain and everywhere else, the recent exposure and downturn force long overdue change fast!

  • #73661
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Goodstich

    “……….in my opinion they do get challenged, and because of public exposure, shame/penalties handed out if they are proved bent, then the majority of good ones are rightly held in high esteem. There have been many cases where people in these proffesions in the UK have been exposed and kicked out”.

    I agree with you. I took a UK firm of lawers to the to the law society and after nearly one year the Law society wanted me to agree to a very small compensation. ( nothing close to the hours I put in and not to mention the complaint in the first place ) The law society conveniently lost my papers and than stopped responding to me.

  • #73712
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Former Mayor of Mijas, Augustín Moreno was ordered by party bosses to lower his salary of 126,000 euros or leave.

    Moreno said he would do exactly the same if he had to make such a decision on this issue all over again. “I worked like a slave as mayor,” he said, “and in a municipality like Mijas, with so much pressure to keep building, a politician has to be economically solvent, have a dignified attitude towards his work and earn a decent salary, to avoid temptation coming his way.” He was totally honest as a politician, he added, and was leaving politics with his head held high.
    http://www.surinenglish.com/noticias.php?Noticia=11020

    😯 😯 He didn’t “avoid temptation” after all ❗

  • #73716
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    “The PSOE admits that the Mayor’s salary was a mistake, but said it was legal, and clear. Future municipal salaries, however, will not be allowed to go higher than the Prime Minister’s”.

    “That’s one small step for man, one giant leap …….. 😉

  • #73718
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    The Mayor of Mijas still retains his other post of “health and Care”. A post which he created two years ago and for which he was the only candidate 🙄

  • #73720
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Augustín Moreno was/is a Gynaecologist – not sure whether he is still in clinical practice though.

  • #73728
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    ……well that might explain the ‘cock up’?

  • #73754
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Roca has now been granted bail at 1 billion €. (1,000 million €).

    Instruction judge Miguel Angel Torres has finally granted bail to Juan Antonio Roca, the ex Real Estate Assessor, said to be at the centre of the corruption in Marbella Town Hall.
    The judge considers that Roca was the alleged brains behind the entire operation, and will charge him with continued bribery, fraud and misuse of public funds, as well as crimes against Hacienda, money laundering, falsehood, illegal possession of firearms, influence peddling and perversion of the course of justice in relation to land planning.

    So I ask:

    1. Why is this individual being granted bail considering it has already been announced he is facing at least nine years in prison?

    2. If Roca is able to stump up the 1 billion €, doesn’t that pose a question in itself…..like where did he get that kind of money?

    3. What’s the betting the next headlines we’ll see regarding Roca will be:
    “ROCA JUMPS BAIL AND GOES MISSING”.

  • #73770
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Judge Torres says that Roca received 42.5 million euros in backhanders 😯

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