Spanish Bank Sales

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This topic contains 36 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew) Fuengi (Andrew) 7 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #55131
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I read in the Mail on Sunday yesterday that some banks are selling their repos direct …it also said that some are being sold with 100% mortgages from the bank
    is this the actual case and if it is what are these properties like and how fussy are the banks over the mortgage ?

  • #93660
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    They are sold to the Tio’s or their nephew & nieces.

  • #93669
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @Pedro_2008 wrote:

    I read in the Mail on Sunday yesterday that some banks are selling their repos direct …it also said that some are being sold with 100% mortgages from the bank
    is this the actual case and if it is what are these properties like and how fussy are the banks over the mortgage ?

    Yes, banks are selling repos with 100% mortgages. The terms are not too bad either (for 100%). The properties vary enormously, but most are neglected/abused IME, and it is commonplace for the properties to be stripped of all fixtures & fittings.

    Also, the banks valuations are on the high side, and you usually need to negotiate pretty hard to get a fair deal.

    As for the previous post, that’s just not the case. Maybe some goes to the families of bank employees, but the sheer volume of repos is more that bank employees could ever absorb. There are a lot f repos out there, and the house keys are still being returned to the banks in huge numbers.

  • #93670
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Shakeel is correct. There are too many but the friends and family get the real bargains. 8) None of the recent off-plan rubbish are a snip.

  • #93671
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    el anciano, is partly correct due to sheer volume The banks have to have the ” pile them high & sell them cheap ” sales model.

    Katy is also correct when she says the best ones will go internally. The conclusion is that as an outsider you will be doing a lot of running around & if you get anywhere it will probably be a property you would not have bought under normal circumstances.

  • #93673
    Profile photo of Chris McCarthy
    Chris McCarthy
    Participant

    @shakeel wrote:

    The conclusion is that as an outsider you will be doing a lot of running around & if you get anywhere it will probably be a property you would not have bought under normal circumstances.

    That has to be one of the most simple yet accurate statements I have read on this forum, right on the money.

    I think I may have said it before; that there is a quote the goes something like…”He who goes by price alone becomes the willing victim of he who sets out his stall by price alone”.

    When you see PPC internet campaigns promising distressed, repossessed, bargain buys and up to 50-60% off, my advice is – beware – this is the last stand of the heat filled presentations of the investment pitch spivs of whom a few remain.

    And as for the banks, they are going to sell nothing at a loss, they will hang on to their inventory till the cows come home, and that could be years, so I am afraid that the average Joe will not see these properties per se and if they do, I think they should take careful note of Shakeels on the money statement above.

  • #93674
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Pedro, most of the banks have opened separate companies dedicated to selling the units/ projects taken back from developers. They have 500,000 to off load (up to 70% off original prices) and will lend up to 100% – something impossible to obtain nowadays no matter how squeaky clean you are.

    A good place to start looking is on idealista.com which is by far the largest portal for real estate in Spain, maybe Europe. Here you can find all the banks real estate arms as well as private individuals trying to sell. It is a comprehensive site covering the country suburb by suburb.

    you also wont find your local friendly Brit agent offering the bank properties because the banks will only deal direct – so they will put you off – check it out – most of the bank web sites translate into English as does Idealista

  • #93675
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @Pedro_2008 wrote:

    I read in the Mail on Sunday yesterday that some banks are selling their repos direct …it also said that some are being sold with 100% mortgages from the bank
    is this the actual case and if it is what are these properties like and how fussy are the banks over the mortgage ?

    Hi Pedro,

    please visit my blog, I have compiled a list of Banks estate agencies
    http://blog.arribaestates.com/2009/06/10/bank-repossessions-costa-del-sol/
    (Mark hope you don’t mind!)

    @UBEDA wrote:

    you also wont find your local friendly Brit agent offering the bank properties because the banks will only deal direct – so they will put you off – check it out – most of the bank web sites translate into English as does Idealista

    don’t paint all brits with the same brush.

    Chris, is right (see link), most of the banks stock is less than desirable… in my humble brit/spanish opinion.

  • #93677
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    thanks all for your help
    definitley not looking for a new development property more a traditional spanish townhouse so I guess there wont be many of those around ..its the idea of a 100% mortgage that apeals to me as I dont have a huge deposit available but I do have a fair monthly income stream

  • #93678
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    just been looking at the above websites thanks for the links …there are so many to choose from its obviously very much buyer beware but you do have to feel there must the occasional gem in amongst them

  • #93679
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I’ve viewed a few. Some were poor, some were nice but in a bad area, one was really nice and in a nice area, but overpriced. However, you can (and should) negotiate prices. IME, the asking prices seem to have at least 20% markup.

  • #93680
    Profile photo of Chris McCarthy
    Chris McCarthy
    Participant

    @El anciano wrote:

    I’ve viewed a few. Some were poor, some were nice but in a bad area, one was really nice and in a nice area, but overpriced. However, you can (and should) negotiate prices. IME, the asking prices seem to have at least 20% markup.

    That’s correct, and I repeat no bank is going to sell the property at a loss.

    As to the 100% mortgage availability, isn’t that what started all this mess?

    And as to the banks marking their properties up, and then offering a 100% mortgage facility just to move it from one side of their balance sheet to the other, does that really help?

    Well Pedro if you want to overpay for the property in the first place because you can afford the monthly payments, but not the deposit, then that is up to you. I think it is perhaps foolhardy though.

    My advice unless you are planning to use the property for a substantial period of time is use those funds to just come here and enjoy the Costa del Sol or wherever you are looking and pay rent.

    I don’t think you will be getting a bargain, I think you will be paying more, I don’t see you getting any equity growth to make up the difference, and the banks are playing the worst kind of game in this regard and have a lot more to answer for in their presentation behaviour and approach than any so called Brit Agency.

    Don’t buy what you can’t afford, and don’t buy what you don’t know is a great price.

  • #93683
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @Chris McCarthy wrote:

    I repeat no bank is going to sell the property at a loss.

    I disagree. They will (and are) trying to make profits, but some of the repos they have will never sell unless marked down heavily. I feel confident that many repos will be sold at a loss to the bank, simply because it makes sense for the banks to offload this stock.

    I had a look at the CAM site yesterday, and they had 4400 residentilal repos in Alicante province alone, and I know that there are plenty more in the pipeline.

    @Chris McCarthy wrote:

    Don’t buy what you can’t afford, and don’t buy what you don’t know is a great price.

    Always the right advice, and this seems to have always been a problem in Spain. But, now more than ever, this is great advice to remember. I know it seems somewhat obvious, but it’s all to easy to be sucked into marketing/sales BS.

  • #93684
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    “As to the 100% mortgage availability, isn’t that what started all this mess? “

    100% mortgages should not be demonised. Like all things in life it may not suit everybody. Besides one should look at the following.

    1) 100% of what, if the Asset is under valued than that’s fine.

    2) One might have 100% funds available sitting in UK and is waiting for the exchange rate to shift in favour of sterling.

    3) Borrow 100% now as the £ improves. Reduce the payments later as & when time is right.

    4) One might be waiting for a sale of property in UK or expecting an inheritance, in the near future to reduce or pay off the mortgage.

    5) One might be on a low salary now. However with promotion qualification the salary can take a big jump.

    Of course, the above can be only done when one knows what they are doing and are on top of things & above all only borrow what they can handle 100 % or 150% is irrelevant. What is relevant is that it does
    do not keep you awake at night.

  • #93685
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @shakeel wrote:

    “As to the 100% mortgage availability, isn’t that what started all this mess? “

    100% mortgages should not be demonised. Like all things in life it may not suit everybody. Besides one should look at the following.

    1) 100% of what, if the Asset is under valued than that’s fine.

    2) One might have 100% funds available sitting in UK and is waiting for the exchange rate to shift in favour of sterling.

    3) Borrow 100% now as the £ improves. Reduce the payments later as & when time is right.

    4) One might be waiting for a sale of property in UK or expecting an inheritance, in the near future to reduce or pay off the mortgage.

    5) One might be on a low salary now. However with promotion qualification the salary can take a big jump.

    Of course, the above can be only done when one knows what they are doing and are on top of things & above all only borrow what they can handle 100 % or 150% is irrelevant. What is relevant is that it does
    do not keep you awake at night.

    All of the above are reasonable arguments for 100% mortgages. But someone, somewhere will expect 90% rental occupancy to make their repayments.

    We shall then have to sit through thread after thread about how they were cajoled into over-stretching their budget by a nasty banker.

  • #93686
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    😆 😆 😆 😆

  • #93687
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    “But someone, somewhere will expect 90% rental occupancy to make their repayments “

    I know, what you mean. However as I said those who know what they are doing. The 90% expectations is a common denominator wheter you borrow 30% or 100% .

  • #93688
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @peter Good wrote:

    We shall then have to sit through thread after thread about how they were cajoled into over-stretching their budget by a nasty banker.

    And Estate Agents in Spain never encouraged over-stretching the budget, did they Peter. 😉
    What was their favourite line….oh yes, “Why not buy two and flip one, my Uncle did it and he’s no fool….”

    Yes, silly those who maybe fell for that, but come on – many in the Estate Agent world are as guilty as anyone for false promises.

    No doubt we’ll now have to sit through thread after thread about how not all agents are the same. 😆

  • #93689
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    😆

  • #93690
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    INEZ,
    very well put

  • #93691
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    And Estate Agents in Spain never encouraged over-stretching the budget, did they Peter. 😉

    On account that that one has been just about done-to-death, I was preparing myself for the next wave of fraudsters 🙁

    @charlie wrote:

    Yes, silly those who maybe fell for that, but come on – many in the Estate Agent world are as guilty as anyone for false promises.

    Yes true, I have been with an Estate Agent this morning who fell for it too! I had to tell her to hang onto them for a few years, which is pretty much her advice to her own clients.

    @charlie wrote:

    No doubt we’ll now have to sit through thread after thread about how not all agents are the same. 😆

    Not really we have done all that and moved on hopefully 😀

  • #93692
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Many local new developments are offering rent to buy. Not a bargain though at around 200,000 for a bog standard 2/2.

    To find a bargain it is best to look at older property that people have owned pre 1999 or so. They are the ones who can afford to be flexible. There does seem to be some good deals on villas.

  • #93693
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @peter Good wrote:

    Not really we have done all that and moved on hopefully 😀

    That’s a relief, especially if you’re talking for all agents here!
    Though bearing you, Fuengi and a few others here in mind, note I did write “many in the Estate Agent world”, not “all”.

  • #93695
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    An Agent who I know has two completions tomorrow. Not bad for a small agency. They will not show anything that they do not have all the paperwork on file (many do) and play by the rules.

  • #93696
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    It’s at least a step in the right direction that EA’s are now supposed to, by law, ensure that all their properties have the right legal paperwork. But many internet agencies are still getting away with it.

  • #93697
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    Though bearing you, Fuengi and a few others here in mind, note I did write “many in the Estate Agent world”, not “all”.

    I know we both went through the exoneration game during my very first posts here Charlie. We did move on relatively painlessly though, so, since those days, my skin has thickened and my forum etiquette mellowed 😀

    But to more worrying matters, since katy sold her neighbours house, she has been slightly talking up the property market, is it possible there is an Estate Agents strain of Swine-flu, passed on through handling property purchase contracts 😕

    I have posted a link below just in case she feels the need for an online diagnosis

    http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Pandemic-flu/Pages/QA.aspx

  • #93699
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    ” EA’s are now supposed to, by law “

    Suppose to & what happens in Spain is at the two end of Spectrum.

    ” ensure that all their properties have the right legal paperwork.”

    Does, anybody knows what is the right paper work in Spain is !!!!!!!!

    THe above is the Spanish problem, Economic cycles comes & goes

  • #93700
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    It’s at least a step in the right direction that EA’s are now supposed to, by law, ensure that all their properties have the right legal paperwork. But many internet agencies are still getting away with it.

    I think that law only applies in Andalucia charlie.

    Those agents who are solely internet based rarely have their own properties, usually they pluck them from other websites and only inform the acting agent if they have an enquiry.

    I have never understood why agents don’t avail themselves of all property paperwork (copies at least) at the point of listing a property as when the client is over and wants to go ahead, you can guarantee the vendor will be away and consequently it will be impossible to draw up a Contracto de Compra Venta. It will then takes weeks of DHL’s inefficiency before a property is safely secured.

    Incidently, for anyone buying a property, it is far better to have the CdCV drawn up by a local notary as this avoids a 2 contract – hidden commission situation- and makes it impossible to be in a black money situation!

  • #93701
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Peter – I have to say that in all postings I’ve ever read of Katy’s, I’ve always found she has been totally unbiased on all subjects, despite not having been involved in any of the negatives of buying in Spain.

    Not only has she lived in Spain for many years, by having Spanish relatives she can see/hear it from all sides. For this reason I always listen to/respect her input.
    I find it ludicrous bordering on the amusing when members who have probably never lived in Spain accuse her of not knowing what she is talking about, as has happened recently.

    And if she’s sold her neighbour’s house, all I can say is “Well done you Katy”!

  • #93703
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    Peter – I have to say that in all postings I’ve ever read of Katy’s, I’ve always found she has been totally unbiased on all subjects, despite not having been involved in any of the negatives of buying in Spain.

    Not only has she lived in Spain for many years, by having Spanish relatives she can see/hear it from all sides. For this reason I always listen to/respect her input.
    I find it ludicrous bordering on the amusing when members who have probably never lived in Spain accuse her of not knowing what she is talking about, as has happened recently.

    And if she’s sold her neighbour’s house, all I can say is “Well done you Katy”!

    Phewww charlie, time for you to take a long dog walk I think!!!! 🙄

    I seem to remember a few posts back that you claimed to have a sense of humour!!!

    I expected katy to see my comment as humorous though perhaps she might not, but that was the intention.

    So, why the outburst charlie, you promised your handbag was back in the wardrobe 😯

  • #93704
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    That wasn’t an outburst!!! But I’ll do one for you if you want! 😆

    I wasn’t trying to be defensive, though re-reading it, it does come across a bit that way. Though must admit have been a bit indignant at some of the comments Katy’s had to endure over the last few weeks.

    Don’t worry about handbags, where you’re concerned I always remember your classic:
    @peter Good once wrote:

    It’s much better when we all get on.

    Tea anyone? 😀

  • #93705
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    of course local agents will demonise the banks initiative to offload what they have taken back from developers; the fact is that the banks have reduced the prices on all units between 20 and 70% from the previous asking prices…. there are great deals to be had in many parts of catalunya and Madrid; not to mention the costas……

    Whilst i previously said the banks don’t work with the Brit agents some are collaborating with local Spanish established agents who are selling up a storm…… (I’m talking about Marbella costa) –

    regards crytalising a loss, the banks are starting to write off amounts (%) that are not realistically recoverable. What they are also going to do to “help” owners who cant pay is do a partnership mortgage (ie we’ll reduce mortgage by 40% for a share in your property. This allows the debtor to stay in the home and pay a manageable amount…….. Socialism a la Zapatero !!

  • #93706
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @charlie wrote:

    @peter Good once wrote:

    It’s much better when we all get on.

    Tea anyone? 😀

    I don’t remember that 😆

  • #93708
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    thanks all for the valuable advice
    I have no intention of rushing into a property deal in the current climate
    but if the right property came along in the right location at a price I could afford then I would be tempted … as you rightly say it could be a long time before any capital growth but if its somewhere I really want to own for the next 20-25 years who cares if I pay a little more for it ? not everyone is going to be able to buy at the very bottom and I’ve done enough trading to know that sometimes just when everyone else is telling you the market is doomed may just be the best time to buy

  • #93711
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    @charlie wrote:

    It’s at least a step in the right direction that EA’s are now supposed to, by law, ensure that all their properties have the right legal paperwork. But many internet agencies are still getting away with it.

    It will be impossible to regulate the ones who run a sales site from their kitchen table. Judging by the lack of estate agents offices on the coast, I would guestimate over 90% are homeworking.

    Well Peter, seems as if I can’t be positive or negative without comment. Maybe I should get another personality and call myself “An spanish ladee” I could then waffle on in imperfect spanglish 😆

  • #93712
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    It will be impossible to regulate the ones who run a sales site from their kitchen table.

    Perhaps they can be regulated under the Health & Hygiene act 🙂

    I suspect your 90% figure would be about accurate katy.

    @katy wrote:

    Well Peter, seems as if I can’t be positive or negative without comment. Maybe I should get another personality and call myself “An spanish ladee” I could then waffle on in imperfect spanglish 😆

    Just stay as you are katy 😉

  • #93713
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @UBEDA wrote:

    of course local agents will demonise the banks initiative to offload what they have taken back from developers; the fact is that the banks have reduced the prices on all units between 20 and 70% from the previous asking prices…. there are great deals to be had in many parts of catalunya and Madrid; not to mention the costas……

    Whilst i previously said the banks don’t work with the Brit agents some are collaborating with local Spanish established agents who are selling up a storm…… (I’m talking about Marbella costa) –

    I disagree. And agencies that do ‘demonise’ bank initiatives are being short sighted. As the faster this stock is sold the sooner the market will return to some semblance of normality.
    Second the reductions of between 20 and 70% should have been done a while ago.
    The whole 100% mortgages in this situation (in regards to bank repos) is a bit deceiving in my opinion.

    To keep it simple:
    Development A
    Bank lends funds to developer to start building.
    Bank is willing to offer 70% mortgage on property. Buyer has to pay 30% in stage payment prior to completion (i am sure several of you are familiar with the idea). on signing the title deeds, banks give mortgage, start making money.

    Developer runs into financial issues and loses the development A.
    Banks tries to sell at same price, no luck. Special offer comes around, 30% off!!!! and 100% mortgages!!!
    Bank is still lending the same sum as they were originally, except now as the owner of property they make more money as their only cost was what they were originally lending to the developer.
    A good time to be a bank. all in all

    And in most cases banks won’t have an agreement with ‘brit’ agencies, due to language barriers, etc… But a few like CAM don’t seem to have any issues with it.

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