Spain slips down the list for Investors.

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This topic contains 24 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of angie angie 8 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #53702
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    Because of all the property corruption in Spain the country has now slipped to 47th in the list for European investors according to a recent statistic in a local paper.

    What does the greedy Spanish Gov´t doing about it all? Nothing, they just aloow more of the same and serves them right.

  • #79124
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @angie wrote:

    Because of all the property corruption in Spain the country has now slipped to 47th in the list for European investors according to a recent statistic in a local paper.

    What does the greedy Spanish Gov´t doing about it all? Nothing, they just aloow more of the same and serves them right.

    There are only 48 countries in Europe angie, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe – I take it we just piped the new state of Kosovo 😀

  • #79129
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Ah, but there’s 195 countries worldwide!

  • #79515
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    Not good though to slip to 47th, at last people are waking up to the fact that Spanish property is no longer a good investment, there are better places to invest now with less corruption and less development!

    Spain´s Gov´t does diddly squat about things!

  • #79518
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    angie

    it never ceases to amaze me either. Tourism and construction, i guess Spains biggest assets of recent years, and the Gov’t seem hell bent on destroying both, with their ‘lets do nothing to make things better’ attitude?

  • #79519
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @angie wrote:

    Not good though to slip to 47th, at last people are waking up to the fact that Spanish property is no longer a good investment, there are better places to invest now with less corruption and less development!

    Spain´s Gov´t does diddly squat about things!

    Not everyone buys a property in Spain to make money angie.

    Most buy here for a change of lifestyle, I did and so have most of the people I know here.

    I don´t care what my house is worth on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. I like my house, I like the location and that´s fine for most people too.

    Spanish property speculators are usually fair-weather friends and not a good thing to build a long-term business around.

  • #79523
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
    angie wrote:
    Not good though to slip to 47th, at last people are waking up to the fact that Spanish property is no longer a good investment, there are better places to invest now with less corruption and less development!

    Spain´s Gov´t does diddly squat about things!

    No place is a good investment in real estate in 2008. The bubble has been inflated all around the world.

    Probably USA might be the first good place to invest in 2009, if the dollar stays around
    50 Penny and houses in good places take a further 30%-40% cut.

    Spain will not be a good investment without a 50% decrease in prices and a 20% decrease in Euro versus Pound.

    About people who want to buy for lifestyle, DO NOT BUY in 2008 in Spain!! The value of real estate will be much lower in a year from now and then even lower in 2010.

  • #79524
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
    Peter Good wrote:
    I don´t care what my house is worth on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. I like my house, I like the location and that´s fine for most people too.

    You do not care because you did not pay an arm and a leg from your house in Spain.

    And I am sure you will not be in negative equity even after a 50% price decrease.

    Present all the details of the matter to potential buyers when discussing about lifestyle purchases…

  • #79527
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    I think 😕 I understand what Peter is saying. If an estate agent told their clients not to buy for a couple of years they may as well shut up shop. Same as the other lifestyle stuff, it really is down to the buyer to do their own research. Likewise if an agent says the land opposite is green belt, never take their word for it. As he says if they ask about schools for the kids, what agent would say “they are rubbish and they will be bullied” I wouldn’t if I were an agent 😉
    My grouse would be with agents (for example in marbella) who knew what was happening and that some developers were building illegaly, or a certain developer had a bad reputation.

    As for some agents now being “honest” and saying prices are crashing…this is the new sales patter, it has replaced the buy now and it will be worth 30% more when completed. Heard on the grapevine that agents are telling sellers to mark up what they want for their property because clients are expecting large discounts. Eg. you want 200,000 for an apartment, ask 235,000 and settle for 195,000 not really a reduction after all…just an MFI sale 🙄

  • #79528
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
    katy wrote:
    As for some agents now being “honest” and saying prices are crashing…this is the new sales patter, it has replaced the buy now and it will be worth 30% more when completed. Heard on the grapevine that agents are telling sellers to mark up what they want for their property because clients are expecting large discounts. Eg. you want 200,000 for an apartment, ask 235,000 and settle for 195,000 not really a reduction after all…just an MFI sale 🙄

    This can work for a very short time and will only apply to uninformed buyers.

    In USA, at the end of 2006 they started offering free cars and free pools to potential buyers of overpriced properties. After 1 year they realised that only lower prices will entice buyers and started cutting the prices.

    Too bad the credit crunch happened in between so now the cuts need to be much bigger.

    In Spain the greed and the lack of market understanding seems to be higher so it seem to take a bit more time for people to realise what they need to do.

  • #79530
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    katy
    Spectator

    Yes, it will crash, just hasn’t happened at this time.

  • #79534
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    Anonymous
    Participant
    katy wrote:
    I think 😕 I understand what Peter is saying. If an estate agent told their clients not to buy for a couple of years they may as well shut up shop. Same as the other lifestyle stuff, it really is down to the buyer to do their own research. Likewise if an agent says the land opposite is green belt, never take their word for it. As he says if they ask about schools for the kids, what agent would say “they are rubbish and they will be bullied” I wouldn’t if I were an agent 😉

    As for some agents now being “honest” and saying prices are crashing…this is the new sales patter, quote]

    You must take the credit katy, you have fully understood my point. I would not want to shut my shop because the boom has ended and prices are falling. I am simply selling my properties for less each time they come down and will no doubt do so for some time to come.

    Katy you are also right that the drop in prices is being used by agents as as a new sales pitch.

    But many buyers walk in and say “is this a good time to buy”. I could say no or I could say yes. It depends on their circumstances. If they want to live in Spain and have sold in the UK then they may as well buy where they want to live, they have to live somewhere.

    As for the kids being bullied at school, the clients off-spring may well be the ones doing the bullying, or worse, the drug dealing and knife carrying.

    The only thing I am certain of at present, is that there are still people buying homes in Spain.

  • #79536
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    I have also heard that sales have improved since Christmas, from a friend whose Son works for an agent, suppose thats sort of reliable 😕

  • #79537
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    I have also heard that sales have improved since Christmas, from a friend whose Son works for an agent, suppose thats sort of reliable 😕

    Could be an area thing again. From Jan through to mid Feb was the first time I have gone for 6 weeks without selling a single property. (I´m sure the exchange rate caused that) In the last 2 weeks my enquiries have really increased and some are now turning into viewing dates. I wonder if buyers are begining to resign themselves to the fact that the rate is not going to improve much and could alot drop further.

    Inez also says she has plenty of clients but not enough bargain properties.

    If prices dropped another 20% or so, maybe those clients will buy.

    The thing I have noticed is that I have more passing trade since half a dozen of my nearest competitors closed their doors.

  • #79538
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
    Peter Good wrote:
    I would not want to shut my shop because the boom has ended and prices are falling. I am simply selling my properties for less each time they come down and will no doubt do so for some time to come.

    Of course you would not want to close your shop and everybody can understand this.

    But you could hint to the sellers that a price drop would make them good.

    As a real estate agent, you would much more profit from a more dynamical market where buyers and sellers are not on stand-by.

    One step to unstuck the market is to tell sellers to lower the prices.

  • #79539
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @ralita wrote:

    @peter Good wrote:
    I would not want to shut my shop because the boom has ended and prices are falling. I am simply selling my properties for less each time they come down and will no doubt do so for some time to come.

    Of course you would not want to close your shop and everybody can understand this.

    But you could hint to the sellers that a price drop would make them good.

    As a real estate agent, you would much more profit from a more dynamical market where buyers and sellers are not on stand-by.

    One step to unstuck the market is to tell sellers to lower the prices.

    Ralita, sellers lowering prices are my biggest headache at present. The amount of work to do this is considerable.

    1) Access internal office data-base to change prices.
    2) Re-print window, internal and book displays.
    3) Upload price change to company website.
    4) Change prices on Kyero and other portals.
    5) Inform UK agents to alter prices in their windows and on their websites.

    As you can imagine, if a seller comes in and askes to drop by 5,000 euros I usually say, do you want to drop it 10,000 and save a visit next month. It sounds cruel I know but it is reality right now,

    I have always been hard on valuations as many will have gathered from earlier posts, I am not about to soften now. Sales happen when a buyer comes along, there is so much choice it is virtually impossible not to have what they want. If the price can be agreed, then the sale will happen.

    Yes we have less sales, but the ones we make seem to go through more quickly when the buyer gets his price accepted.

  • #79540
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
    Peter Good wrote:
    As you can imagine, if a seller comes in and askes to drop by 5,000 euros I usually say, do you want to drop it 10,000 and save a visit next month. It sounds cruel I know but it is reality right now,
    .

    It is not cruel at all. Sellers should live in 2008 and not in 2003-2004 when houses in Spain were selling like hotcakes.

  • #79541
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @ralita wrote:

    .

    It is not cruel at all. Sellers should live in 2008 and not in 2003-2004 when houses in Spain were selling like hotcakes.[/quote]

    It won´t be long ralita before the sellers feel they are in 1995 😆

  • #79542
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    yep

  • #79543
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Peter Good

    ” It won´t be long ralita before the sellers feel they are in 1995 “

    No doupt you will be telling all the potential buyers to wait until this happens. 😀

    Frank 8)

  • #79611
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    😉

    peter, no not everyone buys for investment although most would wish their property to go up, not down, however a lot of dodgy, even crooked agents in Spain and now emerging markets are still hyping up markets as a good investment off-plan which clearly many are not, these crooks need weeding out.

    As Goodstich says, Spain is hellbent on destroying what contributes so much to their economy, they really are shooting themselves in the foot, destroying the dream so to speak.

  • #79613
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    In the long term I think it would be good for Spain if property here wasn’t considered an investment. When we bought here in the 80’s we didn’t even think about it as an investment. It was a place to bring the kids for long summer hols and lots of long week-ends, meeting friends who did the same.

    Everyone in the UK seems to be obsessed by property maybe its a good time for reflection.

  • #79622
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Property price obsession began with the baby boomer generation. Prior to that, few people owned a property. Of those that did, they more often than not stayed put in the same property for the rest of their lives.

    During the 70´s something happened to change the outlook on our primary properties. It was called “inflation”. Wages soared and mortgage repayments began to look quite cheap. People began to move to larger houses, then larger ones still. Inflation continued and large chunks of equity began to appear. People felt rich and could buy luxury goods if they unlocked their equity. This has been the case for the last 30 years or so.

    It´s quite a new phenomenon, and we are now at a point where finance and debt are outstripping earnings and equity.

    No economist in the world can predict what happens next, because, it simply hasn´t happened before in history.

    Yes we know what is coming in Europe, mainly because we are a year or two behind the US. However, they too are at the frontiers of ignorance.

    There are ways of handleing the escalating debt issues, but they stagnate the economy and bring huge job losses.

    The seemingly preferred way at present is for govenments and large corporations to invest in emerging markets like China and India, but this is no cure, just a way of delaying desperate action, as, in the not too distant future, there will be no more emerging markets.

    We really are heading into the unknown!

  • #79626
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    Anonymous
    Participant
    Peter Good wrote:
    Property price obsession began with the baby boomer generation. Prior to that, few people owned a property. Of those that did, they more often than not stayed put in the same property for the rest of their lives.
    We really are heading into the unknown!

    I agree with Peter. The future is really blurry.

    The stupidity or cruelty of Alan Greenspan and other central bank thieves will haunt us for a long time.

  • #79754
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    You´ve only got to look at some of these ghastly constructions, rubbish, potential water shortages, crime, high completion costs, exhorbitant estate agent fees, 1000´s of similar properties, unfavourable exchange rates, etc to see why Spain is just not a good investment anymore.

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