Obama Wins – four more years of decline

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This topic contains 42 replies, has 13 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of GarySFBCN GarySFBCN 4 years ago.

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  • #57132
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Barack Obama has won the 2012 US election to be president of the United States. However, one can already predict that the US economy will be in worse shape when the next presidential election is held in four years time than it is now. The US national debt currently stands at 16 trillion dollars but that will rise to 20 trillion dollars in four years. America’s national debt is increasing by one trillion dollars every year. In four years time it will be increasing by 1.5 trillion every year. The US trade deficit will grow and the purchasing power of the dollar will decline dramatically, losing as much as 50% of its value over the next four years.

    Ben Bernanke, the Chairman of the America’s central bank, the Federal Reserve, has already announced a program of perpetual Quantitative Easing, or indefinite Quantitative Easing, QE to infinity which is designed to buy up the US national debt and buy up mortgage backed securities from the banks. Ben Bernanke hopes that the money printing will not filter into the economy and cause inflation but inevitably it will and when it does it will be explosive. Wall street are pleased that Barack Obama is back as President of the US because it will mean more political gridlock that they will get more cheap money from the Federal Reserve due to more Quantitative Easing which will mean bigger bonuses for speculators and the people who work in the banks. However, the people on main street will get hammered with higher inflation and more quality higher paying jobs disappearing from the economy to be replaced by more low paying jobs which involve serving fries to people. America will continue to see the destruction of its middle class with good jobs going overseas.

    A war with Iran to prevent the country from developing a nuclear weapon is certain in the next few months. The American people have unwittingly voted for further economic decline, and a war that is really just designed to help Israel just like the war in Iraq.

    The 10 year US treasury bond price is at an all time high and the yield on the bonds are at 1.69% which is at an all time low which means that you are getting a poor return on bonds and the US bond market is in a gigantic bubble that will ultimately burst causing more money printing and higher inflation. The high demand for US treasuries reflects the flight to safety from the economic problems of Europe.

    Some people say that the best way Americans can protect themselves from the collapse of the fiat money system is to buy gold and silver, but anybody buying gold and silver now are buying into a bubble and will be paying a high price. A probably better solution would be to convert all your money to Swiss Francs since the currency is very strong but the currency is over valued at present. Despite all the problems with the countries in the Euro zone the Euro currency should hold its value in the long term because it will effectively just end up being the Deutschmark when countries like Greece, Spain, Portugal and Italy finally leave the Euro.

  • #113287
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    Some pundits are predicting boom times ahead for the US thanks to cheap energy from fracking.

    http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-newspaper-daily-english-online/columns/25-Oct-2012/the-new-oil-and-gas-boom

  • #113289
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    I expected Obama to win again despite predictions of a close run race, out of the two I’m happier with ‘the devil we know’ rather than Romney, just generally feel he’s more stable for some reason and for World matters rather than start again with an unknown.

    He’s a great speaker which seems to win him lots of votes of confidence, but he has a lot of unfinished and new work to complete 😛

    However the Dow seems to have fallen heavily so far, not sure why so big a fall 🙄

  • #113291
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    You can often trust the betting sites to have it right. They had Obama as 70% chance of winning.

  • #113292
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    However the Dow seems to have fallen heavily so far, not sure why so big a fall

    Bank stocks leading the pack down because the suspicion is that Obama will impose regulations to keep them solvent.

    The best candidate won. Romney would have been a disaster, especially for the economy.

    Not to go down the path of nationalism, but anyone who has visited the US knows that despite our many problems, we have great economic synergy that is absent in Europe.

    We are seeing real recovery and nobody it talking about going to war with Iran. More hysteria from Jake.

  • #113294
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    Gary, later in the evening I saw the Dow and other stock markets had fallen was more to do with continuing European worries, Greece again etc, not that Obama had won 🙄

    Tend to agree with your para ref. ‘US great economic synergy which seems absent in Europe’ generally 😉

  • #113296
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    The principal lesson I have learned during this US election campaign is how America now has changed and evolved into a more racially, sexually tolerant, liberal society.

    The Republican Party of America looks out of touch and increasing irrelevant trying to preserve a stagnant religious based status quo. The Democrats appeal to a younger generation of Americans who demand and actively seek change in their society.

    It’s not just Obama, he is the desire symbol the catalyst of a entire generational movement. He has the ability to communicate the ambitions of this generation in a similar way Reagan did in the eighties.

    I watched the election party headquarters on TV as the results came through. I was struck how the crowds in each party HQ differed. The Democrats were a diverse mixture of every racial group imaginable and predominantly young or early middle aged. The Republicans were almost all an older generation of white, well heeled suit and tie wearers. It was very revealing.

    Some states have now voted for same sex marriage, and the legalisation of Marijuana use. Abortion is no longer the taboo it used to be or even a relevant political ideal. The old grey bible thumpers have finally been marginalised amd pushed back where they belong.

    I have great hopes for the US in the future. I am confident their economy will turn and forge ahead soon. It always has and always will. Their energy, enthusiasm, innovation, sheer American know-how and drive to succeed will see to that.

  • #113298
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    I have great hopes for the US in the future. I am confident their economy will turn and forge ahead soon. It always has and always will. Their energy, enthusiasm, innovation, sheer American know-how and drive to succeed will see to that.

    Why is Britain such a bureaucratic and non-enthusiastic, little-innovative country?

    Americans and British are supposed to kind of have the same origins…

    In America they emphasize on research and discovery, here in UK they emphasize on how to make life difficult for the ones who want to do research and discover (at least in academia).

  • #113299
    Profile photo of angie
    angie
    Spectator

    flosmichael, I think it’s to do with America being dubbed ‘the land of opportunity’ for years, everyone wanted to go there especially Europeans. A huge diverse country which opened it’s arms to innovation and enterprise.

    The UK like many European countries is smaller and probably more narrow in thinking, but UK is not alone in the bureaucratic stakes, but does have a successful technological history I believe.

    Maybe things are changing, a programme last night showed how £1 and 99p shops were thriving now in the UK, like Aldi and Lidl too as well as in Spain, sign of the times? 🙄

  • #113300
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    The Republican Party of America looks out of touch and increasing irrelevant trying to preserve a stagnant religious based status quo. The Democrats appeal to a younger generation of Americans who demand and actively seek change in their society.

    That is true. What’s more is that the Republicans have ‘branded’ themselves as being anti-science and anti-middle-class.

    They deserved to lose and they did sustain huge losses across the US. For example, in California (still the world’s 8th largest economy), the Republicans have behaved so badly that for the 1st time in 80 years, because of Republican losses, there are so few Republicans in the two legislative houses of the state government that they are 100% irrelevant. They can stay home for the entire year and there will be no change in the legislative outcomes. (Regardless of our liberal ‘image’, in the last 50 years, moderate Republicans have been elected governor of California about 75% of the time.).

    In order for the Republicans to win, they have to stand-up for the middle class. They have to purge their party of misogynists, racists, homophobes, and especially, the anti-science Christian right.

  • #113301
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @garysfbcn wrote:

    In order for the Republicans to win, they have to stand-up for the middle class. They have to purge their party of misogynists, racists, homophobes, and especially, the anti-science Christian right.

    would there be any republicans left in the party?

  • #113302
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    I agree Gary.
    The checks and balances in the US political system have unfortunately recently contributed to the economic stale mate.
    Political parties are now faced by the system the founding fathers created to co-operate with each other. That’s no bad thing. I believe most Americans are politically moderate and believe in fairness and co-operation.

    Americans will not understand if the Republicans in the congress block Obama’s measures in finding a bipartisan solution to avoid the coming ‘fiscal cliff’ on January 1st. If this looming crisis goes unresolved, any hope for a US economic recovery is questionable.

    The Republican Party are going to have to seriously re-invent themselves if they ever seek to be politically relevant again.

  • #113303
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Only hope for the republicans is to embrace the libertarians. Economic extremly to the “right” and freedom wise extremly to the “left” in american terms. Don’t lump them together with the media view of the TEAbaggers. Had Ron Paul gotten the chance Obama would be gone by now. Obama lost 10 million votes this time around and still quite easily won which says more about the republicans. The US needs to abolish their two party system to make it more dynamic. I’m just loving it watching all of these FOXNews people going nuts about Obama “priceless”. Entertainment for the whole family. =)

    Republicrats got what they deserved. They are just another welfare party but catering to slightly different group of people and I hate their base for being so close minded about gays, science etc.

    It’s actually sad that the US once a bastion of at least personal and economic freedom has turned into just another european country plus the warmongering and religious nuts. Everything I loved with the US has slowly dissapeared and I hope it’s not forever.

  • #113304
    Profile photo of peterhun
    peterhun
    Participant

    @flosmichael wrote:

    @logan wrote:
    I have great hopes for the US in the future. I am confident their economy will turn and forge ahead soon. It always has and always will. Their energy, enthusiasm, innovation, sheer American know-how and drive to succeed will see to that.

    Why is Britain such a bureaucratic and non-enthusiastic, little-innovative country?

    Americans and British are supposed to kind of have the same origins…

    In America they emphasize on research and discovery, here in UK they emphasize on how to make life difficult for the ones who want to do research and discover (at least in academia).

    According to a Japanese government organization, 80 out of the most important 100 inventions of the 20th century were British.

    Britain is a remarkably innovative country.

  • #113330
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Big inflation coming

    Well, Americans voted and the winner is inflation. Half our voting populace inexplicably decided to award a second term to Obama. Four more years of mind-boggling record deficits and record national debt growth! Obama’s Administration spent roughly 50% more than the government took in, which can essentially only be financed in two ways. Borrowing from foreigners and running the printing presses.

    The latter of course is pure inflation. And the Fed bent over backwards with its quantitative-easing campaigns to buy massive amounts of the Treasury debt Obama ran up on our children’s credit cards. It created trillions of new fiat dollars out of thin air to purchase Treasuries to finance Obama’s trillion-dollar-plus annual deficits. And with Obama sticking around, this dangerous trend is only going to accelerate.

    The ironic thing is inflation wreaks the most damage on the people with the least. Its corrosive effects on purchasing power are felt most at the margin, among the poor and minorities whose overwhelming support of Obama carried him to victory. They apparently didn’t care about the crushing unemployment rates among blacks, Hispanics, and the young from Obama’s policies, but they will care about inflation.

    Inflation is a simple supply-and-demand phenomenon, economics 101. When the supply of money grows faster than the economy, the underlying pool of goods and services on which to spend it, it takes more money to buy anything. Relatively more dollars are competing for relatively fewer things, bidding up their prices. With more dollars in circulation, each one is worth less. So prices inexorably start rising.

  • #113336
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Jakesuper there would have been no difference if Mitt had been elected. He would have spent more on foreign wars and in that sense Obama is better.

  • #113337
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    logan
    Participant

    This poster Jakesuper does not get involved in one to one debate Ardun. He or she simply copies and pastes web articles that further it’s strange monosyllabic cause of gloom and doom. It’s a machine that has no place in a forum where interesting debate often takes place from humans with readable ideas and opinions.

  • #113339
    Profile photo of Igurisu
    Igurisu
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    This poster Jakesuper does not get involved in one to one debate Ardun. He or she simply copies and pastes web articles that further it’s strange monosyllabic cause of gloom and doom. It’s a machine that has no place in a forum where interesting debate often takes place from humans with readable ideas and opinions.

    I agree, just a copy and paste merchant and seems incapable of thought or debate.

  • #113342
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @igurisu wrote:

    @logan wrote:
    This poster Jakesuper does not get involved in one to one debate Ardun. He or she simply copies and pastes web articles that further it’s strange monosyllabic cause of gloom and doom. It’s a machine that has no place in a forum where interesting debate often takes place from humans with readable ideas and opinions.

    I agree, just a copy and paste merchant and seems incapable of thought or debate.

    I like to think that I am one of the better contributor’s to the forum.

  • #113343
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    …Some states have now voted for same sex marriage…

    I personally don’t approve of same sex marriage or gays adopting children. There is no way that you can say that homosexuality is the same as heterosexuality. It is this moral depravity that is helping to destroy America.

  • #113344
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    @jakesuper wrote:

    It is this moral depravity that is helping to destroy America.

    ……………and it’s fascist attitudes like that which led to the destruction of Europe. 👿

  • #113351
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @jakesuper wrote:

    I personally don’t approve of same sex marriage or gays adopting children.

    care to back that up?

    @jakesuper wrote:

    There is no way that you can say that homosexuality is the same as heterosexuality.

    no one does, that why they have different names.

  • #113353
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    I personally don’t approve of same sex marriage or gays adopting children. There is no way that you can say that homosexuality is the same as heterosexuality. It is this moral depravity that is helping to destroy America.

    While I’m somewhat flattered that anyone would ascribe power to me and my husband, so much power that we can “destroy” countries just by being married (we are legally married in two countries), the facts do not coincide with Jake’s rant.

    Same sex marriage has been legal in Canada for 11 years. It is also legal and/or recognized in Sweden, Norway, Argentina, South Africa, Denmark, The Netherlands, Belgium, Iceland, Portugal, Israel and Mexico. It is also in the process of being legal and/or recognized is dozens of other countries. I haven’t seen the destruction of Canada or any other country because of my marriage. Maybe I’m not trying hard enough.

    It is because of attitudes like Jake’s that instead of making financial investments that would add to the stability of a neighborhood, city, county, state or country, I work to remain fiscally nimble, ready to pick-up and move to a place where fascist attitudes are not welcome.

  • #113356
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/12/college-humor-gay-men-will-marry-your-girlfriends-video_n_2117777.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false#sb=2594445,b=facebook

    Never really understood why anyone want would want to forbid to consenting adults to do whatever they want. It’s like forbidding horror movies because you yourself don’t like them.

  • #113359
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @Ardun wrote:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/12/college-humor-gay-men-will-marry-your-girlfriends-video_n_2117777.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false#sb=2594445,b=facebook

    Never really understood why anyone want would want to forbid to consenting adults to do whatever they want. It’s like forbidding horror movies because you yourself don’t like them.

    I am in no way homophobic but I have to say that marriage is a union between a man and a woman. Children are brought up in a loving relationship between a man and a woman. It seems that gays want the best of both Worlds. They want to live out their rather unconventional lifestyle and yet want the trappings that belong to normal people. Can you imagine how screwed up a child will become if that child was brought up by a gay couple as opposed to a couple consisting of a man and a woman? Children have rights and deserve to be brought up by a normal heterosexual couple. How can a gay couple explain to a child the beauty of a Marilyn Monroe or Chelsea Charms with a magnificent 164 tripple X chest.

    Chelsea Charms interview on the British day time ITV television programme “This Morning” with Phillip Scofield

  • #113363
    Profile photo of Chopera
    Chopera
    Participant

    @jakesuper wrote:

    @Ardun wrote:
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/12/college-humor-gay-men-will-marry-your-girlfriends-video_n_2117777.html?utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false#sb=2594445,b=facebook

    Never really understood why anyone want would want to forbid to consenting adults to do whatever they want. It’s like forbidding horror movies because you yourself don’t like them.

    I am in no way homophobic but I have to say that marriage is a union between a man and a woman. Children are brought up in a loving relationship between a man and a woman. It seems that gays want the best of both Worlds. They want to live out their rather unconventional lifestyle and yet want the trappings that belong to normal people. Can you imagine how screwed up a child will become if that child was brought up by a gay couple as opposed to a couple consisting of a man and a woman? Children have rights and deserve to be brought up by a normal heterosexual couple. How can a gay couple explain to a child the beauty of a Marilyn Monroe or Chelsea Charms with a magnificent 164 tripple X chest.

    Chelsea Charms interview on the British day time ITV television programme “This Morning” with Phillip Scofield

    Well the two female friends of mine who got married last year might be able to, but then again I doubt they’d do something so creepy as to go round telling children why they find certain parts of certain women attractive. More likely they’d try to avoid imposing on their children any false sets of values regarding sexual orientation.

  • #113364
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    Too everyone, sorry about going of topic, but

    @jakesuper wrote:

    I am in no way homophobic but I have to say that marriage is a union between a man and a woman.

    First and foremost this sentence is homophobic. You are saying that 2 consenting adults and not entitled to the same ‘rights’ as other people due to sexual orientation. that is discrimination. So yes you are homophobic.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Children are brought up in a loving relationship between a man and a woman.

    being raised by one man and one women, its not the ideal. the ideal is being raised by a multi-generational family, not the ‘atomic’ family that has been the increasing norm over the last century. Also your one man one women arguement does not seem to be that common in many parts of the world.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    It seems that gays want the best of both Worlds.

    the audacity! to be treated like everyone else. what must they be thinking!

    @jakesuper wrote:

    They want to live out their rather unconventional lifestyle and yet want the trappings that belong to normal people.

    that is because they are normal.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Can you imagine how screwed up a child will become if that child was brought up by a gay couple as opposed to a couple consisting of a man and a woman?

    yes because a man and women will always better better than 2 women or 2 men. Just look at how normal most people are that are raise by heterosexuals.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Children have rights and deserve to be brought up by a normal heterosexual couple.

    a child deserves to be raised by loving parents.

    Now if you want to keep to this foolish and ignorant point of view on this forum, try backing it up with some empirical data, that we can review and refute, or do shut up about your personal views and lets stick to spanish property related issues.

  • #113365
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @garysfbcn wrote:

    Same sex marriage has been legal in Canada for 11 years. It is also legal and/or recognized in Sweden, Norway, Argentina, South Africa, Denmark, The Netherlands, Belgium, Iceland, Portugal, Israel and Mexico. It is also in the process of being legal and/or recognized is dozens of other countries. I haven’t seen the destruction of Canada or any other country because of my marriage. Maybe I’m not trying hard enough.

    you forgot spain

  • #113366
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @fuengi wrote:

    …do shut up about your personal views and lets stick to spanish property related issues.

    Alright, I will go back to talking about the Spanish property market..err..house prices are slightly down today to what they were yesterday and they will be slightly down tomorrow and the next day and so on and so forth. You can see a trend can’t you, house prices in Spain just keep going down.

  • #113369
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    Jake wrote this: “I am in no way homophobic…” And Jake wrote this: “It is this moral depravity…”

    Time for Jake to own that he/she/it is homophobic.

    Let me provide an example of how businesses have recognized the ‘gay market’: A few weeks ago, my husband and I were in a big department store in a ‘conservative’ area in California, shopping for clothes. A representative of the store, carrying a clipboard, approached us and asked if we were interested in remodeling services for our home. It turns out that the department store offers these services. We decline and he gave us a brochure and business card for later consideration. A few minutes later, he approached what appeared to be another gay couple, asking the same thing. The store representative did not appear to be gay. It seems as if this was a store policy – targeting a newer market.

    Minimally, those who rant about gays, Chinese, Russians, women, etc. are cutting themselves off from potential business. Unless it made good business-sense, I would never choose to do business with Jake because of his homophobia. When shopping and/or doing business, my money is my power.

    And smart business people would be targeting new populations in Spain by offering good services at reasonable prices, and without making people within those populations feel exploited, That is where the money is right now and it is largely untapped.

  • #113374
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Homophobia is just one more example of the ignorance’s and prejudices certain sections of society possess everywhere. Time will change that and gay marriage will soon be accepted as perfectly normal as any interracial marriage is now.

    I’m old enough to remember how much a taboo that was. Societies are dynamic, attitudes change with each new generation. Provided countries have governments who encourage liberalism, openness and freedom of thought.

    There are actually parts of the USA where Darwin’s book ‘ The Origin of the Species’ is banned in schools. Creationists and religious zealots hold sway.

    I have read some creationist books and I have never inflicted on myself such unadulterated rubbish. Yet in free societies we allow such nonsense to prevail and be available to any one who wants to read it. Long may that continue.

    People make up their own minds eventually about most things and Jake’s idea of gay marriage leads to moral decline belong in the same trash can. Decline from where? A society conserving a narrow status quo that suits very well a small number of the population.

  • #113382
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    … Time will change that and gay marriage will soon be accepted as perfectly normal as any interracial marriage is now…

    Homosexuality will never be accepted as normal in the Muslim/Islamic World particularly in the middle east like Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Kuwait, United Arab Emirates, Libya, Egypt, Morocco, Jordon, Algeria, Sudan, Yemen, Syria, Turkey, Tunisia, Oman, Pakistan, Iran.

    In Africa 38 out of 53 countries have criminalised consensual homosexual sex.

    Homosexuality is just plain and simply misogyny. Some gay men wear makeup just like women and wear womens clothes which kind of begs the question why do some gay men find this attractive and not find the genuine article in the form of a real woman attractive. What do gay men have against women? The answer is obvious. Because Homosexuals are sexist towards women and many are women haters.

  • #113383
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Can’t speak for all gay men but I have a couple of gay friends and a gay BIL and they aren’t women haters!

  • #113384
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Homosexuality will never be accepted as normal in the Muslim/Islamic World particularly in the middle east like Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Kuwait, United Arab Emirates, Libya, Egypt, Morocco, Jordon, Algeria, Sudan, Yemen, Syria, Turkey, Tunisia, Oman, Pakistan, Iran.

    afghanistan allows for pederasty
    turkey has held gay public events
    Iran allows transexuals to have a sex change
    being gay in egypt is not illegal. just the public affection bit
    just a few examples.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    In Africa 38 out of 53 countries have criminalised consensual homosexual sex.

    actually 20 countries or so have now legalised same sex relations. (in 2 cases its legal for women only)

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Homosexuality is just plain and simply misogyny.

    first, how can being homosexual show a dislike for women, when women can be homosexual as well.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Some gay men wear makeup just like women and wear womens clothes

    being transgendered does not mean you are gay.

    @jakesuper wrote:

    which kind of begs the question why do some gay men find this attractive and not find the genuine article in the form of a real woman attractive.

    according to the ‘balancing selection hypothesis’ its a genetic trait. The part about being gay. regarding what we as individuals are attracted to, that down to a wide range of variables,

    @jakesuper wrote:

    What do gay men have against women? The answer is obvious. Because Homosexuals are sexist towards women and many are women haters.

    Strawman argument.

  • #113385
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    @jakesuper wrote:

    Homosexuality will never be accepted as normal in the Muslim/Islamic World particularly in the middle east like Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Kuwait, United Arab Emirates, Libya, Egypt, Morocco, Jordon, Algeria, Sudan, Yemen, Syria, Turkey, Tunisia, Oman, Pakistan, Iran.
    In Africa 38 out of 53 countries have criminalised consensual homosexual sex.

    Are you holding up the countries you mention as some paragons of virtue? Most on your list are backward, developing countries with authoritarian governments. They enshrine the suppression of women, deliberately keep them uneducated and preserve entire generations as chattels for men to do with whatever they choose.

    How do you square that with your beliefs of moral decline in the world? Homosexuality is normal. It’s just a sexual preference and been so since the dawn of time.

  • #113387
    Profile photo of Fuengi (Andrew)
    Fuengi (Andrew)
    Participant

    absolutely right logan.

    although i would argue that it is sexual orientation, not preference (implies choosing to be gay, etc…)

  • #113389
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    Homosexuality is just plain and simply misogyny.

    And then Jake provides a list of countries where ‘homosexuality will never be accepted’, the majority of which are extremely oppressive to women. And then he discusses men who dress as women, ignorant of the facts:
    * The majority of men who dress as women ‘cross dressers’ are heterosexual.
    * The majority of gay men are not cross dressers.
    The most important fact is that Jake’s posts should be ignored. Like a broken clock, he may be right about something two times each day. But given his doom and gloom, his hysteria, and now his homophobia, it is very clear that Jake is an idiot.

  • #113390
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Yes he is an attention seeker, sounds like a typical loser too. We should ignore him 😛

  • #113394
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    logan
    Participant

    I don’t believe comments such as his should be ignored. Ignoring extremely unpleasant ideas tacitly infers acceptance. Even on a small audience forum such as this.

    History shows us that extremists gain a foothold in main stream thinking because people of good will do nothing. I defend Jake’s right to express his twisted views but they cannot be allowed to go unchallenged.

  • #113395
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    I agree Logan. Everything needs to be challenged all the time otherwise society won’t move forward. It’s the same with immigration policies for example. When the “normal” parties doesn’t want to talk about it because of political correctness it just gives ammunition to the real extremists out there. A healthy debate does not hurt anyone and it’s better that it’s brought up to surface.

  • #113398
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Gay marriage bill is rejected by Australian parliament

    Australian members of parliament have overwhelmingly rejected a bill that would have legalised gay marriages after days of heated debate.

    The House of Representatives voted 98 to 42 against the bill, with one MP resigning a key post after making controversial comments against it.

    Australia does not permit gay marriage, though some states allow civil unions.

    Gay rights activists called the decision a “slap on the face,”.

    Catholic aide says gay men commit most paedophilia

  • #113399
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Obama wins, homosexuality, cross dressing, women supression. What forum am I on ??????

  • #113400
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    Obama wins, homosexuality, cross dressing, women supression. What forum am I on ??????

    Welcome to Jake’s world. He is so disengaged that he doesn’t know when to stop. I won’t comment on the link to an article (from 2009) that he just posted, other than to say that long ago, some organizations lost their moral authority to tell us anything about morality.

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