major construction faults and paying a surveyor

LoadingFavourite

This topic contains 29 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Anonymous Anonymous 9 years, 9 months ago.

  • Author
    Posts
  • #52634
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    We are a development of 2 phases. Since moving in we have become concerned with the major faults and defects we have found. The constructor says he will fix things when Phase 2 is finished.

    Ten days ago we had heavy rain for one morning causing the basements to flood in some of the houses – water was coming in through the walls! Every week we seem to have something else go wrong. In early December the constructor cut through half the site’s telephone cables leaving us without phones and internet connection.

    We do believe they will resolve issues as it will affect sales if they don’t. However, they may not resolve things satisfactorily and they may ignore issues which affect Phase 1 only.

    Our Sec/Administrator is not pro-active. He has sent photographs by Burofax to the constructor and they have until the first week of March to respond.

    We have obtained a copy of our Securo Decenal.

    We have been advised that we should employ a surveyor or technical engineer to produce a report which makes our complaints official and details to the constructor what needs to be done to fix the faults (they are likely to do a quick fix if left to themselves).

    My questions are: can we collect and pay for the surveyor’s fees via the Community Charge ensuring all pay? We are not a majority, the constructor is. It is not clear from reading The Law of Horizontal Property if there is something which covers this situation.

    and

    Is it adviseable to call in the company who has underwritten the Seguro Decenal?

    Many thanks for any advice you can give.

  • #69218
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi

    Try this link http://www.eyeonspain.com/spain-magazine/snagging-survey.aspx which has information.

    The guy that wrote it maybe able to advice or help etc, let us know how you go on.

    Have you tried your community insurance?

    Regards

    Paul

  • #69221
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Jayne,

    Can you be more specific on the “major faults and defects” you mention but fail to specify.

    The “Seguro Decenal” is only meant for major structural flaws, not for flaked painting, cracked walls, mismatching floor tyles, ill-fitting doors etc…

    The Building Act (Ley de Ordenación de la Edificación) has three types of guarantees depending on the nature of the damage. That’s why I would appreciate you explaining in detail what you mean by “major faults” before I can reply.

    Did you carry out a snagging before completion ?

    Snagging must always be done prior to completion as it is blatant.

  • #69224
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Draken,
    I agree that snagging should be done before hand. I however notice that developers are not keen on doing this until the contract has been notorised.

    I also understand that lack of snagging does not allow the buyer to not to complete, (surely until you are witholding the completion you have some kind of influence on the developer and if the developers has to do the snagging why cant he do at the time. The buyer is satisfied and happy)
    another quirk of Spanish law.

    Further, many of the new builts will not have water/electricty so items such as plumbing,electrical/TV connection etc, cannot be checked.

    In my property the developers has been in and out at least six times for the same thing. I cant see why it could not be done propery in one or two goes. Maybe the sub contractors are paid by the visits they make.

    In my experience the developers have no concept of quality control and in the case of a very large developer from Galicia, who does not even have a after sales department.

  • #69227
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @shakeel wrote:

    Hi Draken,
    I agree that snagging should be done before hand. I however notice that developers are not keen on doing this until the contract has been notorised.
    .

    Hi Shakeel

    Our clients never complete without having done a snagging list first for all too obvious reasons.

    It’s up to your lawyer to press on this matter. If you have agreed that you will do the snagging after completion you are held by that. It’s up to you to negotiate to have it done before, the developer will always want it done after completion, once you’ve paid, so there are no delays.

    As we -normally- complete with LFOs in place there is mains water and regular electric supply.

  • #69228
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Draken,

    I agree with you. I did not use a lawyer and when I took advise from one on the issue. I was told by a lawyer that lack of snagging does not stop you from completing.

    I am a bit confused about the water/eletric. Yes the LFO is there, but there is no water/electricity connected from the developer until you take the contract to the respective utility.

    The snagging is done in the interm i.e. transfer from the developer to the buyer.

  • #69232
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    No, not snagging. We had a long enough list for snagging items, which some 7 months later have not been completely finished (the hard items are being ignored).

    Our problems are damp in half of the houses in the basements (we think because there is no land drain or it is not deep enough.

    Sewage pipes which have been laid at the wrong levels. The outflow pipes from the houses are lower than the pipe which takes the waste to the drains.

    A garden water feature which has never worked correctly and at the moment has surface electric cables running alongside water.

    Telephone cables cut off late last year and no urgency to fix them.

    Broken drain covers and man hole covers where the heavy machinery runs over them. The covers are laid on flimsy terracotta bricks – not an engineering brick in sight. We cannot park on our drive as we fear the car will fall down the holes.

    Gardens which haven’t been thought about where water pools and sits against the house. Communal gardens which act as a large pond when it rains heavily. The absolute shock was when the water came in through the walls of a block of 6 houses leaving the basements flooded.

    Your advice would be very helpful.

    Thanks.

    Jayne

  • #69233
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Who is the developer ?????

  • #69234
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    When did you complete Jayne ?

  • #69237
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi

    I’d rather not say who they are as it could identify the development and it wouldn’t be fair to other owners. However, they are a major company but with probably more experience in commercial builds than residential.

    We completed in early July 2006.

    Jayne

  • #69238
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    An afterthought – the Securo Decenal was taken out by the constructor in October 2005 so it is already counting down. Presumably this was the time the first phase was signed off by the architects. The LFO is dated May 2006.

  • #69243
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I take it you did the snagging after completion. The whole point of doing a snagging list before completion is that you apply pressure on the developer to get the flaws fixed by “trying” to delay completion until they are mended.

    The Seguro Decenal does not cover these type of “minor” problems Mrs Jayne.

    1.- You have a first guarantee of one year deadline (july2006-july2007) for building or execution defects. So you are still in time for it fortunately. This is thought for flaked painting, dampness, flimsy terracotta tiles, brocken drain covers etc…

    2.- You have a second three year guarantee as from completion date (july 2006-july2009) to complain regarding this. I would include the sewage pipes, outflow pipes, large pond (although this doesn’t really affect your property but the whole community).

    3.- The third guarantee is the ten year insurance which from what you right is not your case as there is no serious (from a legal perspective) structural flaw in the building/dwelling.

    You’ll need to hire a good independent lawyer to help you claim. It takes some time but it eventually gets fixed.

    You can always PM me for more private queries if you wish. I normally reply every 2-3 days.

    Regards
    Drakan

  • #69267
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    We have a technical engineer/surveyor from the College of Architects, Technicians and Builders visiting us tomorrow.

    What I urgently need to find out is can we force our Secretary/Administrator to pay their fees from the Community Charges? We would be willing to increase the Community Charge to cover this additional expense but we want to ensure the surveyor’s fee is paid by all the owners including the unsold properties whose fees are being paid by the Constructor.

    What we don’t want is the scenario where some people keep their heads down, don’t get involved, don’t contribute but their properties are improved by the contribution of others.

    All the properties are affected by the flooding or the damp which are the two issues we want the surveyor to report on.

    Many thanks.

    Jayne

  • #69273
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I think not. Perhaps some lawyer or someone will differ from me.

    But the fact is that it’s you calling him privately not the Community of Owners (the developer has the majority ? ).

    My comments were all referred to your property, not to dampness all over the development.

  • #69283
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Drakeen

    All the Owners are asking for the surveyor’s report but no, sadly we are not the majority but one vote away!

    Thanks everyone for your responses.

    Jayne

  • #69284
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Errm Jayne, “Drakeen” sounds like drag queen … 😕

  • #69285
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Drakan/Drakeen

    …….could be worse, at least you’re not called sofiA !!

  • #69288
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Yes, my apologies. I should have checked. It would be nice to see the posts you are replying to when you are responding.

    I’m sooooo sorry Drakan.

    Jayne

  • #69290
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Just kidding. 😉

  • #69296
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Oooooh! You’ve let Jayne off lightly Drakan. When I mispelt your name(Draken) when you first joined the forum, you really rapped me over the knuckles!!! They’re still smarting. 😆

  • #69298
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Har har. I remember. I was more aggressive back then Claire, now I take life more calmly. 😉

  • #69303
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Iv’e noticed! 😉

  • #69304
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    I think Drakeen lends a rather mysterious air to you Draken… 😆

  • #69305
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Take cover Inez…you’ve mispelt his name!! 😆 hit the edit button quickly! 😉

  • #69307
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    Crikey I have havent I ! – that’ll teach me to try and be clever before the morning coffee!

    I HEREBY WISH TO PLACE A PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT OF APOLOGY TO DRAKAN

    We all love you and do respect the advice you freely put upon these delicate pages and I am sorry for mispelling you name not once but teice.

    I stand duly chastized, abashed and ashamed. 😳

  • #69308
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Grrr Inez, “Drakan”. 😉

  • #69309
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    EEEK !!! Ouch ! 😯

  • #69319
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    We have compleated last oct we snagged and handed list we first snagged before our lawyer signed she told us all problems were solved when we got there none had been done we have since had rain coming in through the roof something we could not have known as no rain untill now. we have visited the builder on a number of times but get no help the new girl in the office who is leaving because of all the complaints said we will not gett any work done. we compleated late but though our lawyer told us we would be able to claim under contract before we signed but after we signed we pressed her to claim her answer was she had asked the builder to pay but they said they did not want to this seemed to be her final answer to our problem.i have spoken to a number of others on our complex who have several problems and wish to claim but we feel that most lawyers are tied in to the builders as they get a lot of work from them also though i have not had this confirmed the builder in question has built many more complexes and are still building but they apparentley close down when people claim for delays and repairs and reopen under simalair name ie gropo torque 1 0r 2 0r 3 😕 Alegedley i add.Any advice please.

  • #69321
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Let’s get this straight:

    Your lawyer should advise you to carry out a snagging list before completion. It’s not illegal or anything to do it after completion but it is not advisable. It’s like completion in an off-plan without a LFO, it’s not illegal to complete without it but it is not advisable in most cases (there are exceptions to this “general” rule of course).

    Normally the purchaser carries out a snagging list before completion and does not complete until after having made sure that the flaws have all been fixed by the developer (if it’s off-plan).

    The reason being is that you have more power to negotiate when you haven’t completed yet than after. Because once you have completed you are left almost powerless as you have already paid in full the purchase price.

    But all this depends heavily on the wording of your private contract. You cannot delay completion because you are not happy with the snagging unless this is worded expressly into the contract.

    On acting on behalf of a developer, I will not allow a purchaser to delay completion just because of this and I will not allow them to do so unless it’s worded into the private contract, and I’ll make sure it isn’t. 😈

    If whomever you have appointed to act on your behalf, whether it’s your lawyer, friend, EA approves the snagging list, then… it has been approved -period-. Remember they are acting on your behalf.

  • #69398
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Thanks we have a standard contract our lawyer clearly told us that our snagging had been done and she signed on our behalf, she also told us before she signed that we were entiteled to claim for delays as per contract as she put it no problem. But once she had signed she back peddeled said she had asked builder if he wanted to pay for delays they said no {surprise} she seems to think thats the end of things. Though she said she new the builder before we engaged her and said they were good she also said she had no conection with them we have no reason to disbelieve this but wait to see how she handles our letter regarding snagging not been done as she claimed. Thanks for info i have to say we looked at everything we could think of before buying with the help of people of this fourm but if people just tell you lies then no matter how carefull you are there will be problems. My advice to any of my freinds who ask me about buying abroad dont do it there are too many loop holes and doggey people. Once again thanks for your input lets hope we can solve our little problems Regards Paul

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.