Las Vegas Sands plans mini-Vegas in Spain (Euro-Vegas)

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This topic contains 73 replies, has 20 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Anonymous Anonymous 2 years, 12 months ago.

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  • #56115
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    Anonymous
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    Read it in the FT, so one assumes it ain’t made up 🙂
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/cb5331fa-3ac0-11e0-9c1a-00144feabdc0.html?ftcamp=rss#axzz1EIbnP9Sm

    Vegas has it’s problems today, not least a real estate crash, but vice always sells, and a Euro-Vegas would have more chance of success than a Paramount theme park, in my opinion.

    The big question is, if it goes ahead, where will it be……?

  • #102871
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    Inez
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    ‘Someone’ will have to ‘invent’ and New New NEW Golden 5 Miles!! lol

  • #102873
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @mark wrote:

    The big question is, if it goes ahead, where will it be……?

    On the site of the failed Paramount Studios which are due to go on the site of the failed Polaris World, perhaps?

  • #102878
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    Inez
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    No – Im SURE it will be the failed Disney site here this end!!

  • #102887
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    Anonymous
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    Having had experience in putting together feasibilities of this type of property development the Costa del Sol will win hands down over Madrid, Barcelona and Valencia. Forget the gaming aspect, as the strip mall concept has changed completely since its interception, a visit to Las Vegas shows that. Just image the people who will come to the theme parks, conferences and sunshine, thousands if not millions. The new Malaga airport can handle 20 million now. Just look at what this guy open last April in Singapore, 11 million people a month having being visiting every month since. This would be a huge boost for the CD. Just my opinion.

  • #102890
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    Anonymous
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    Actually, its quite amazing that something half decent hasn’t been done already.

  • #102941
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    katy
    Spectator

    Not sure but I think spanish law would have to be changed?

    If you look at all the Casino resorts around the world Spain will have a lot of competition, quite a few in Europe, Baden Baden, Monte Carlo. Super ones in the Bahamas. Sun City in S. Africa. The Singapore one owes it’s success as it attracts the Chinese and other Asian clientele who are gambling crazy.

  • #102955
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    Anonymous
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    If you mean about the Casino License laws in Spain, then I agree with you, they will have to be changed. But having being involved in the building of Sun City and then being part of the professional team with the owner, as one of our clients, it helps in understanding what is being planned in Spain.

    But this development is not just about the users at the casino tables, it is about the one arm bandit machines, the slots, that is where the big money is. To my knowledge there is nothing in Europe that is comparable to what they planned to build and the whole of the Sun City complex in S.Africa is not even a 10th of the size they are talking about in the press release. Old traditional casinos are not the competition, so Monte Carlo and rest will not be effected. Not sure about Baden Baden as I have never been there but all the other places like the Bahamas, Dubai and the rest I have. Singapore has always had Raffles Casino and Singapore is also highly regulated, just as it is in Spain.

    All people are gaming crazy but again this is not just a casino, what about the huge number people attending conventions, theme park visitors, people from the cruise ships (665,000 in 2010) and do not forget the golfers and sun seekers. If the CDS gets this development then it will transform the area completely – just imagine a Las Vegas strip combined with Disney Orlando and then you are getting the picture.

    Spain desperately needs a major construction boost to employ all of the out of work builders. This development would provide it, as this sort of development is built in what we called fast tracking building. This sort of construction method needs a very large labour force to achieve this.

    On another thread on this forum the question being asked is has the bottom been reached in property prices. Where ever this development goes the property prices will only go one way – upwards with immediate effect. In my humble opinion I do not believe there is any competition for Euro – Vegas anywhere in Europe.

  • #102963
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    katy
    Spectator

    We cruise every year out of Florida. The casinos are busy with the slots all the time, almost exclusively Americans and I don’t think the majority would dream of travelling anywhere else.

    Wasn’t there some pie in the sky scheme before on here….maybe in central Spain?

  • #102964
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    Anonymous
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    @PhilipN51 wrote:

    If you mean about the Casino License laws in Spain, then I agree with you, they will have to be changed. But having being involved in the building of Sun City and then being part of the professional team with the owner, as one of our clients, it helps in understanding what is being planned in Spain.

    But this development is not just about the users at the casino tables, it is about the one arm bandit machines, the slots, that is where the big money is. To my knowledge there is nothing in Europe that is comparable to what they planned to build and the whole of the Sun City complex in S.Africa is not even a 10th of the size they are talking about in the press release. Old traditional casinos are not the competition, so Monte Carlo and rest will not be effected. Not sure about Baden Baden as I have never been there but all the other places like the Bahamas, Dubai and the rest I have. Singapore has always had Raffles Casino and Singapore is also highly regulated, just as it is in Spain.

    All people are gaming crazy but again this is not just a casino, what about the huge number people attending conventions, theme park visitors, people from the cruise ships (665,000 in 2010) and do not forget the golfers and sun seekers. If the CDS gets this development then it will transform the area completely – just imagine a Las Vegas strip combined with Disney Orlando and then you are getting the picture.

    Spain desperately needs a major construction boost to employ all of the out of work builders. This development would provide it, as this sort of development is built in what we called fast tracking building. This sort of construction method needs a very large labour force to achieve this.

    On another thread on this forum the question being asked is has the bottom been reached in property prices. Where ever this development goes the property prices will only go one way – upwards with immediate effect. In my humble opinion I do not believe there is any competition for Euro – Vegas anywhere in Europe.

    If Spain had this, it would only serve to help Spain. This would be a great move for Spain in which ever location it was placed. Not everyone wants to go all the way to America!

    Spanish alone are big gamblers and love slot machines and most forms of gambling. And so do tons of other europeans, this combined with the sun and sea and the relaxed lifestyle Spain offers, would do nothing else but improve its current situation.
    Let’s see where they decide to put it! May have a little look on Spanish websites to see if I can find out some more info.

    http://www.elpais.com/articulo/sociedad/Vegas/Madrid/Barcelona/elpepusoc/20110218elpepusoc_15/Tes

    seems like they are looking into either Barcelona or Madrid!

  • #102966
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    Anonymous
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    The sky in the pie project a while back was not from a mover and shaker background as the guy behind this Euro – Vegas. The guy is a major operator, he knows how to put these developments together but they all want major government concessions like taxes breaks or development grants and that is what will be going on at central government in Madrid at the moment.

    According to reports our current Mayor in Marbella has already made approaches and if you get the Junta of Andalucia involved as well, then again the CDS looks in a favourable position. Anybody who knows the area will know that under the new PGOU 2010 of Marbella a convention centre is planned opposite El Corte Ingles in Puerto Banus. From my understanding all the architectural drawings have been completed but just lacking backers. The Town Hall has been looking for investors to put money into it. This is not pie in the sky stuff, it is all included in the approved PGOU 2010.

  • #102967
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    katy
    Spectator

    There is hardly any room left in Banus for that scale of project 😆 Personally it would be my worst nightmare to see such a project on the CDS. I spent a few nights in Vegas and hated it, only redeeming positives was the excellent shows and close enough to take a trip to the Grand canyon. Logical place would be in Almería but then there are the water problems. As an investor I would go for Barcelona area.

  • #102969
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    Anonymous
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    This development would not be in Puerto Banus but farther down the coast as it needs to be a stand alone resort. Vegas is like it is now because of when it was built original nobody in the right mind would copy that today. Vegas had to reinvent itself a few years back because of dwindling numbers hence why now all the hotels have some form of theme element to them. Why is Orlando, Florida one of the biggest convention centres in the world, because of all the things you can do with the delegates in between the convention schedule.

    Barcelona or Madrid airport would struggle with a massive increase in numbers on top of there usual amount, Malaga has plenty of spare capacity. Also lets not forget the Middle Easterners love to gamble and they love Andalucia. So do the Eastern Europeans but as always with these types of developments they are not integrated into local towns, they stand alone. 10 – 15 billion euros investment can buy a huge developments resort.

  • #108736
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    DBMarcos99
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    Looking like the site will be Alcorcon in Madrid area, if it goes ahead

    http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2012/05/06/madrid/1336326675.html

    Makes sense in a lot of ways – Barajas with its 4 terminals can cope with the numbers, the fast speed trains nearly all connect to Madrid, and no beach to distract the punters from spending money in the bars and slots machines…
    Big drawback for local people in Madrid is this will set off the house price boom again – first time buyers had only just benefitted from more reasonable asking prices

  • #108737
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    GarySFBCN
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    This will do more harm than good.

  • #108738
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    DBMarcos99
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    @garysfbcn wrote:

    This will do more harm than good.

    I hear this a lot, but no-one seems to mind Macau, Singapore or even Gibraltar earning a good deal of money from gambling?

    It will create jobs in the construction and hotel industry at a time they are sorely needed. Believe me a lot of people down on their uppers will be very grateful if this goes ahead.

  • #108741
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    logan
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    Who is going to gamble there? The Europeans have no money. Will the Chinese and oil rich Arabs flock to Madrid or Barcelona just to gamble there when they have the entire world to choose from?
    Las Vegas was created by a bunch of prohibition crooks on the make. Casinos and gambling always attract crooks who muscle in eventually.
    As Noel Coward said once of Monte Carlo, ‘it’s a sunny place for shady people’. Spain has enough of them already. 🙄

  • #108742
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    peterhun
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    You get casino’s in all sorts of odd places but few people make a special trip to them. There is four in the Seychelles and one in Le Touquet, does anyone really care?

  • #108743
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    DBMarcos99
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    http://www.forbes.com/sites/afontevecchia/2012/04/30/eurovegas-adelsons-bet-to-keep-las-vegas-sands-shares-outperforming-even-apple/

    Las Vegas Sands has made clear its intention to develop what has come to be known as EuroVegas, a project about half the size of the Las Vegas Strip that seeks to capitalize on substantial business that is tourism in Europe. As Forbes’ Steve Bertoni reported, the casino-mogul is looking to continue expanding his gambling empire after his successful stint in Macao and Singapore.

    Well, they’ve made money in Macao and Singapore. We’ll see if they do the same in Spain, assuming the project does go ahead (the word is a decision will be made this month). It is a country that attracts between 40 and 50 million tourists a year, so they should get their numbers if they market it right.

  • #108744
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    katy
    Spectator

    Macao and Singapore are completely different from Europe…may as well be another planet re. gambling. I still don’t think it will happen…nos veremos :mrgreen:

  • #108745
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    This is at least not a pure rip off scheme as the other so called projects around Spain. This would be a great thing for the Madrid area but expect to be ripped off by Adhelsonn. I’m actually amazed that that he even would atempt such a thing since Spain usually wants to meddle to much in things like this.

  • #108760
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    Anonymous
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    It will be either in the area of Madrid, or close to Barcelona. However, it looks more like Madrid, as the area around Barcelona does not allow the highness that they want to use for the building. In Madrid there is no problem with it. The investor has been this week visiting the Madrid area for it.

  • #108768
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    DBMarcos99
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    Now there is a plan to build Ferrari World in Valencia (there is already one in Abu Dhabi)

    http://www.eleconomista.es/valenciana/noticias/3957320/05/12/Un-fondo-arabe-negocia-invertir-945-millones-en-un-parque-tematico-de-Ferrari-en-Valencia.html

    No idea how likely this plan is, but wouldn’t it have been more lucrative in the UK, perhaps near Northampton?
    Good news for racing fans in the Levante I suppose.

  • #108770
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    Anonymous
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    is it sunny in Northhampton ???????????

  • #108771
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    DBMarcos99
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    @maseratialfa wrote:

    is it sunny in Northhampton ???????????

    They have a drought! Plus no Gota-Fria!! 😉

  • #111987
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    DBMarcos99
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    @dbmarcos99 wrote:

    Looking like the site will be Alcorcon in Madrid area, if it goes ahead

    http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2012/05/06/madrid/1336326675.html

    Makes sense in a lot of ways – Barajas with its 4 terminals can cope with the numbers, the fast speed trains nearly all connect to Madrid, and no beach to distract the punters from spending money in the bars and slots machines…
    Big drawback for local people in Madrid is this will set off the house price boom again – first time buyers had only just benefitted from more reasonable asking prices

    It’s being talked about as a done deal. Aguirre has shook on the deal with Sheldon Adelson, and the EuroVegas site will be at Alcorcon in Madrid.
    Obviously there is still time for the deal to be called off, but even so, I expect a lot of visits to Alcorcon estate agents…

    http://ccaa.elpais.com/ccaa/2012/09/04/madrid/1346752699_341204.html

    Edit: Spokesmen at Las Vegas Sands Casino are saying nothing has been finalised yet.

  • #111988
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    katy
    Spectator

    Followed your link and breaking news at the top of the page is…….

    Madrid ahora
    Última hora
    EL PAÍS

    Sin decisión por Eurovegas. Las Vegas Sands no ha tomado todavía ninguna decisión sobre el lugar que acogerá el complejo Eurovegas, al que optan Barcelona y Madrid, según informa a Efe fuentes de la compañía. Tomás Gómez ha dicho que se instalará en Madrid http://cort.as/2QT7

    Hace 19 minutos

    Eurovegas states they have not taken a decision, announced 19 mins ago 😆 😆 😆

    Won’t happen, bet my shirt on it :mrgreen:

  • #111990
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    DBMarcos99
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    @katy wrote:

    Followed your link and breaking news at the top of the page is…….

    Madrid ahora
    Última hora
    EL PAÍS

    Sin decisión por Eurovegas. Las Vegas Sands no ha tomado todavía ninguna decisión sobre el lugar que acogerá el complejo Eurovegas, al que optan Barcelona y Madrid, según informa a Efe fuentes de la compañía. Tomás Gómez ha dicho que se instalará en Madrid http://cort.as/2QT7

    Hace 19 minutos

    Eurovegas states they have not taken a decision, announced 19 mins ago 😆 😆 😆

    Won’t happen, bet my shirt on it :mrgreen:

    Did you see my edit? — Edit: Spokesmen at Las Vegas Sands Casino are saying nothing has been finalised yet. —

    It’s to be announced in September, so we’ll see!

  • #111991
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    katy
    Spectator

    How could I have seen it….you edited 1 minute after I had posted 😛 😆

  • #111993
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    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    How could I have seen it….you edited 1 minute after I had posted 😛 😆

    Doesn’t matter either way, does it?

    But as I said, we’ll see within weeks if the story is correct. Judging by the reaction of various anti-EuroVegas corners on Burbuja and on Twitter, it seems to strike a chord… I wonder if that’s the reason the Ibex has been doing well recently?

  • #112016
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    DBMarcos99
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    Now there are reports (via ABC and Eleconomista) that the site is actually Paracuellos del Jarama (still in Madrid). Seems a bit close to the airport to me..
    The article mentions something about an announcement being made at 10 pm Spanish time. But doesn’t state on which day. 😉

    http://www.eleconomista.es/economia/noticias/4225941/09/12/A-vueltas-con-Eurovegas-el-enclave-sera-Paracuellos-del-Jarama-segun-ABC.html

    El diario ABC apunta hoy que Sheldon Adelson, el magnate tras el proyecto, se reunió en agosto con la presidenta regional, Esperanza Aguirre, que interrumpió sus vacaciones para sellar el acuerdo.

    We’ll see soon if the ABC sources are reliable.
    btw, keeping an eye on Percival Manglano.

  • #112042
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    katy
    Spectator

    Some of the media claim this “announcement”was made to detract from the latest unemployment figures and the state of the spanish economy. In other words hot air 😆

  • #112046
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    DBMarcos99
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    The overwhemling majority of the media seem to be saying it’s a done deal. It’s been confirmed and agreed already, and the announcement will be made within a week or two, probably at the “state of the community” ceremony next week in Madrid. I suppose it’s possible that the journalists at all those institutions – ABC, ElPais, ElConfidencial, Eleconomista etc – have been misinformed, or it’s part of some conspiracy to hide data on a particular day, but it does seem very unlikely. Still, we shall see! 8)

  • #112091
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    DBMarcos99
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    Just had a look at Metrovacesa share prices over the last week. Some lucky traders have made a fortune! (I slipped up here, should have invested instead of posting here 🙁 … )

    (btw I’d sell those shares again sharpish if the rumours I’m hearing now are correct… going to look at the FT site… )

  • #112100
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    DBMarcos99
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    Well it’s official now

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/09/07/las-vegas-sands-names-madrid-as-preferred-location-for-european-development/

    It does depend on finding suitable finance backing from banks (LVS will only put up 25-35% of the equity) but given their success with Marina Bay Sands I can’t see this blocking the project. Besides which the banks need this type of speculation (see my link at foot in spanish).

    It will make it a lot harder to find reasonably priced housing now in Madrid. Of course confidence will return, and those caught out by the property price collapse may find it easier to sell their home. So, this will be good for jobs and general confidence, but won’t alleviate the high price of accommodation in Madrid.

    This article is in Spanish and perhaps shows the influence of banks and land developers. Be very careful if you want to make investments based on proposed projects, as it’s likely you won’t know the full story.
    http://lordciruss.wordpress.com/2012/09/07/eurovegas-metrovacesa-y-los-grandes-bancos/

  • #112102
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    @dbmarcos99 wrote:

    Well it’s official now

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/09/07/las-vegas-sands-names-madrid-as-preferred-location-for-european-development/

    It does depend on finding suitable finance backing from banks (LVS will only put up 25-35% of the equity) but given their success with Marina Bay Sands I can’t see this blocking the project. Besides which the banks need this type of speculation (see my link at foot in spanish).

    They are expect the ECB to provide 75% of the funding.. riiiight, the German taxpayers will be rolling about laughing at that one.

    Never going to happen.

  • #112103
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    DBMarcos99
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    @peterhun wrote:

    @dbmarcos99 wrote:
    Well it’s official now

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/09/07/las-vegas-sands-names-madrid-as-preferred-location-for-european-development/

    It does depend on finding suitable finance backing from banks (LVS will only put up 25-35% of the equity) but given their success with Marina Bay Sands I can’t see this blocking the project. Besides which the banks need this type of speculation (see my link at foot in spanish).

    They are expect the ECB to provide 75% of the funding.. riiiight, the German taxpayers will be rolling about laughing at that one.

    Never going to happen.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/09/business/global/madrid-wins-bid-for-las-vegas-sands-casino-and-resort.html?_r=1

    There’s nothing in your link that indicates LV Sands are restricting any seeking of capital to the ECB – why should they? Wasn’t needed in Singapore or Macau..

    Sands is hoping to limit its contribution to 25 to 35 percent of the equity of EuroVegas, and said it would explore “financing options from the capital markets for the project.”

    I have to admit that I thought myself the financing would be difficult, if Sands is only putting up 25%-35%

    But apparently banks can lend out many times what they’ve received in deposits, via fractional reserve banking. I don’t claim to fully understand this, but surely Sands will just be borrowing against assets that will generate money, as per their Marina Bay Sands project?
    http://www.discusseconomics.com/banking/where-do-banks-get-their-money/

    These are simplistic examples of how banks create money using the scenario of a single Bank acting as a monopoly in the banking industry. It may seem like money is created out of thin air but that’s not exactly the case because behind every loan is an asset. Huge trouble develops when the asset becomes worthless (many homes); someone needs to face all the losses.

  • #112104
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    DBMarcos99
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    @PhilipN51 wrote:

    If you mean about the Casino License laws in Spain, then I agree with you, they will have to be changed. But having being involved in the building of Sun City and then being part of the professional team with the owner, as one of our clients, it helps in understanding what is being planned in Spain.

    But this development is not just about the users at the casino tables, it is about the one arm bandit machines, the slots, that is where the big money is. To my knowledge there is nothing in Europe that is comparable to what they planned to build and the whole of the Sun City complex in S.Africa is not even a 10th of the size they are talking about in the press release. Old traditional casinos are not the competition, so Monte Carlo and rest will not be effected. Not sure about Baden Baden as I have never been there but all the other places like the Bahamas, Dubai and the rest I have. Singapore has always had Raffles Casino and Singapore is also highly regulated, just as it is in Spain.


    Spain desperately needs a major construction boost to employ all of the out of work builders. This development would provide it, as this sort of development is built in what we called fast tracking building. This sort of construction method needs a very large labour force to achieve this.

    On another thread on this forum the question being asked is has the bottom been reached in property prices. Where ever this development goes the property prices will only go one way – upwards with immediate effect. In my humble opinion I do not believe there is any competition for Euro – Vegas anywhere in Europe.

    An old quote – but I fear he’s right as regards the property price going upwards now in Madrid (that poster had thought the CDS would have been a better location).
    We don’t need to ask the Question – will the banks benefit from rising property prices? The game is rigged.

  • #112113
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    “But apparently banks can lend out many times what they’ve received in deposits, via fractional reserve banking.”
    Banks have destroyed themselves far beyond their ability to survive, never mind lend out more. The ECB needs to lend the Spanish banks 400billion to stop them crashing. The idea that they would they use it to build another useless property speculation project is bonkers. German taxpayers paying for more useless Spanish infrastructure ??? No going to happen

    I find it extremely unlikely any other international banks would want to get into a bullshit scheme like this. Spain is not a place anyone would invest money in – until the euro situation is sorted.

    I thought you were being sarcastic in your posting, apparently not.

  • #112295
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    Anonymous
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    Kinda sad really but look at what people are posting in the comment section. Physician looking to get in to the project… people seems really desperate.

    As I have said earlier this man “Sheldon Adelson” is evil and I would not want anything to do with him but when people get desperate they will do anything.

    This is at least a viable project which cannot be said about a lot of other so called “theme parks” that are being discussed all over Spain.

    What this means is that Adelson will put up about 5% of those 25%-30% of the money needed the rest he will borrowed from banks. Smart people like him will probably get those 5% from other investors so in reality he is not taking any risk at all.

    This is how weird fractional banking works. Most people will now asume that he is using 25-35% of his own ill fought money which is so far from the truth.

  • #112297
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    Chopera
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    I’d laugh my head off if they ended up building it in Seseña

  • #112304
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    katy
    Spectator

    …and I’ll eat my hat if it ever gets off the ground 😆

  • #112306
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    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    Rough translation to English:

    Esperanza Aguirre’s resignation was neither for personal reasons or illness. The reality is that Esperanza Aguirre was forced to resign, after holding a serious battle, which had its peak in a heated argument between the two, which occurred on Tuesday, September 4 Rajoy’s office. The cause of the confrontation are agreements unilaterally assumed the Madrid president with the group that wants to build Eurovegas and significantly exceeding their powers, leaving mere stooge of Rajoy as this juicy business.

    This seems serious enough to jeopardize the Eurovegas project and allows for Germany to point to incompetence if they want to back-out of any fiscal bailout of Spain.

    http://www.diarioelaguijon.com/noticia/5702/LOS-AGUIJONAZOS/Rajoy-obligo-a-dimitir-a-Esperanza-Aguirre-tras-una-bronca-por-Eurovegas.html

    I got the link from Edward Hugh’s Facebook.

  • #112309
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    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    I’m struggling to think of a situation where Rajoy was able to tell EA to stand down. I just don’t see it. In fact if anything Rajoy has been looking shaky all summer. Ok, there’ve been a few green shoots this month (lending costs down, the Ibex shooting up, various international companies investing in Spain, high tourism figures), but Rajoy’s still walking a tightrope with bigger issues threatening to dethrone him (regional debts, lending costs, Catalunya talks).

  • #112688
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    Igurisu
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    A possible hiccup in the way http://www.murciatoday.com/could-madrid-lose-the-eurovegas-macrocasino-project-over-no_smoking-issue_13314-a.html . Funny thing the smoking legislation and how it is enforced (or not). My wife and I went on a driving tour of Germany earlier this year, every bar and restaurant (and there were many 🙂 )we went in permitted smoking. When I had a chat with a few of the bar owners/managers the explanation was very simple, no smoking in bars is bad for business. So they just ignore the law and let people smoke. When I asked about any police action they just said “police like to smoke and drink as well”.

    We visited Tenerife in February this year and a few bars allowed smoking, we found the same when we went to Valencia in May. Here in the UK I’ve never found anywhere that allowed smoking inside since the ban was introduced.

    Not wishing to start a pro/anti smoking debate, just commenting on how the legal situation about smoking is ignored in some countries.

  • #112691
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    Chopera
    Participant

    I had also heard the rumour about Aguirre’s resignation being related to smoking laws and Eurovegas. I’m pretty sure it was she who messed around with the original implementation of non-smoking laws in Madrid – instead of banning it she tried to make it discretional for bars less than 100m2 (i.e. no bars implemented it). I’m also pretty sure she has strong ties to the smoking lobby (amongst others) and I’m very glad to see her go.

  • #112864
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Prime Minister Rajoy says he wants to get Eurovegas off the ground as soon as possible:
    http://www.rtve.es/noticias/20121015/rajoy-ignacio-gonzalez-coinciden-ir-juntos-para-sacar-adelante-eurovegas/570278

  • #113711
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    Las Vegas Sands announce they have got the necessary funding to start construction in December 2013

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/10/18/construction-of-eurovegas-to-start-in-december-2013/

    Las Vegas Sands president Sheldon Adelson announced on Tuesday that the firm has attracted sufficient funding to begin construction of mega-casino complex Eurovegas in December 2013.

  • #113723
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Sheldon Adelson one of the most evil men in the world. Congratulations Spain! If you joke about costa del crime they were all small fish compared to this guy.

    I wish he would have stayed away from the limelight after betting on Mitt Romney in the election.

  • #113727
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    @dbmarcos99 wrote:

    Las Vegas Sands announce they have got the necessary funding to start construction in December 2013

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/10/18/construction-of-eurovegas-to-start-in-december-2013/

    Las Vegas Sands president Sheldon Adelson announced on Tuesday that the firm has attracted sufficient funding to begin construction of mega-casino complex Eurovegas in December 2013.

    …and the Paramount theme park in Murcia plans to start construction in January 2012, plus the new(??) airport at Covera will start operating in March 2012 😆 😆 😆 Opposition says it is all propaganda! Have seen photos of the stone they laid in the summer, now covered over by sand, actually it wasn’t a stone, just a square block of concrete. Probably a couple of bulldozers will be seen digging over a field…still no investors 🙄

  • #113728
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    @dbmarcos99 wrote:
    Las Vegas Sands announce they have got the necessary funding to start construction in December 2013

    http://sandsconfidential.com/2012/10/18/construction-of-eurovegas-to-start-in-december-2013/

    Las Vegas Sands president Sheldon Adelson announced on Tuesday that the firm has attracted sufficient funding to begin construction of mega-casino complex Eurovegas in December 2013.

    …and the Paramount theme park in Murcia plans to start construction in January 2012, plus the new(??) airport at Covera will start operating in March 2012 😆 😆 😆 Opposition says it is all propaganda! Have seen photos of the stone they laid in the summer, now covered over by sand, actually it wasn’t a stone, just a square block of concrete. Probably a couple of bulldozers will be seen digging over a field…still no investors 🙄

    Well I can’t say much about Murcia as I don’t know the area, but it’s looking increasingly likely that the EuroVegas project will go ahead. Various laws (to the annoyance of the opposition to the plan) are being carried out by Madrid.
    http://elpais.com/elpais/2012/12/03/inenglish/1354540705_180096.html
    The financing, which some claimed would be a sticking point appears to be much in hand. Indeed, if the banks did fail to provide financing there’d probably be plenty of investors in a share issue, seeing how Sands have given a huge dividend payout instead of paying anticipated tax rises.
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-11-26/las-vegas-sands-adelson-to-earn-1-2-billion-from-dividend-1-.html

  • #113733
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Evil does what evil wants. He will use it to launder cartel money which I guess won’t hurt Spain to much. What I’m afraid will happen is that the tax payers will subsidize it a lot in the hopes of it picking the economy up.

    You can’t trust him.

  • #113749
    Profile photo of kgpoc
    kgpoc
    Participant

    DBMarcos99 – I like your optimism in this project but I doubt it has more than a 5% chance of going through regardless of the year.
    1. Individual Casinos never enter into project on this scale. Until you have at least another 2 casinos or world wide resort buying into the project, it is still a project being sold not a project being started. A good base example is the redevelopment of Macau (5 initial casinos, and 2 Resort/hotel groups). There are no other groups listed at this stage.
    2. What makes supper complex modern casinos function are the full family entertainment amenities. Last time I checked theme parked attractions in Spain are dying. So if we believe a company is going to build just a huge casino I am not sure what draw it will have.
    3. Sands just pulled forward a large dividend of which they had to finance with short term debt, effectively they have shot their debt wad for next year possibly 2. This project can only go forward with debt finance, no European bank will go for an equity style agreements in Spain attached to more building. A US banks might join but they would split it between about 5 – 8 of them due to the risk.

  • #115094
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    News today is that Alarcón has been confirmed as the site for Eurovegas, where it will cover 750 hectares.

  • #115096
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    Article here (in Spanish) on the likely winners

    http://www.intereconomia.com/noticias-negocios/empresas/quien-gana-eurovegas-20130208

    No surprise that the owners of that land come out on top – particularly Metrovacesa. The biggest shareholder of Metrovacesa is Santander, so perhaps it was inevitble their shares would rise today (currently up 1.74%)
    The article states it’s good news for people about to be employed in the construction process. It’s also good news for property owners in Alcorcón – even if they don’t want to be close to this development, the new economic activity will push up house prices (and ensure the current empty places get taken up).

  • #115105
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @mark wrote:

    News today is that Alarcón has been confirmed as the site for Eurovegas, where it will cover 750 hectares.

    Sorry, it is Alcorcon, to the SW of Madrid.

    Alarcon is halfway between Madrid and Valencia.

  • #115129
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Yes Flosmichael, you are right. It is Alcorcón, not Alarcón.

  • #115141
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Sheldon Adelson made most of his wealth in Las Vegas Casinos when the US Mafia were controlling them. His business ethics will sit well in today’s corrupt Spain. He can enjoy tax unfettered profits simply by giving the PP millions. Rajoy and he will become best buddies. 👿

  • #115143
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    Sheldon Adelson made most of his wealth in Las Vegas Casinos when the US Mafia were controlling them. His business ethics will sit well in today’s corrupt Spain. He can enjoy tax unfettered profits simply by giving the PP millions. Rajoy and he will become best buddies. 👿

    A bit like Amazon, Google, Starbucks etc.?
    Like it or not this is the way national economies are going. International companies have too much power.

  • #115155
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Really good for the area to get this project I can’t see much negative to come from it as long as the government is restrictive in how much tax money is plowed into it. I have never doubted Adelsons capacity to take on a project like this albeit I don’t like him which is totally different from when fraudsters that try to flogg the Paramount park project in Murcia.

  • #115241
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    First pics of what it is supposed to look like

  • #115242
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    ha ha, the first pic looks like two fingers…. hope it’s not to represent the macho Spanish mentality?

    Joking aside though, it does looks good and if it encourages jobs then has to be good. Just worry about the problems with gambling etc. it will cause.

  • #115244
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    @itsme wrote:

    ha ha, the first pic looks like two fingers…. hope it’s not to represent the macho Spanish mentality?

    Joking aside though, it does looks good and if it encourages jobs then has to be good. Just worry about the problems with gambling etc. it will cause.

    Will it cause gambling?
    I don’t get this argument, fully. People can do the lottery (or bet on horses, football matches) from their laptop or smart phone. Or they can pop out to the local bookmakers. Most bars in Spain seem to have a slot machine blaring out their dingles. If someone is susceptible to gambling they’ll be hooked long before getting on a flight to Barajas.
    I agree that anyone who goes here (or to Singapore or to Las Vegas) merely to bet, deserves what they get. But part of the appeal of Las Vegas and their like is to see great shows, relax and yes, have a flutter as a one-off on holiday. The addicts in Spain (or in the UK or in Germany, Russia etc) who will go to Eurovegas, are already addicts?
    Should we ban the Grand National or the Cheltenham Festival because gambling addicts may be in the crowd?

  • #115245
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    In the casinos onboard American cruise ships there is a steady queue of people applying to have their credit limits increased. I don’t understand gambling but serious gamblers use the internet too. Not having casinos won’t stop them.

    My Cousin’s ex-husband lost everything through gambling, business, home etc. He would gamble on 2 flies on a wall, if there hadn’t been a bookies he would have found a way.

    These companies are very good at mock ups to attract investors aren’t they 😆 😆

  • #115246
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I consider myself lucky that I’m not a gambler, because I’ve seen many friends succumb and in some ways it’s worse than alcoholism – you can only drink so much before you make yourself sick, but gambling truly has no limits.

    Las Vegas has it’s business off to a fine art, if you’re sitting at the slot machines, the drinks are free and you can smoke too. All three addictions are fed at once, along with the addictive noise from the blinking fruit machines and waitresses not picked for their personalities.

  • #115256
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I agree with Marcos it’s not like a casino in todays age will complicate gambling problems. Mock ups look good.

  • #115262
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    @Ardun wrote:

    Mock ups look good.

    Don’t they always 😆 😆

  • #82657
    Profile photo of DBMarcos99
    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    More details on proposed plans today. The quantities look incredible – if it wasn’t for the fact they’d built a huge complex in Singapore (and attracted huge numbers), I’d disbelieve the viablity myself..

    La primera fase de Eurovegas tendrá 1.000 kilómetros de tendidos de redes de agua, saneamiento, comunicaciones y energía, algo así como todo el cauce del río Ebro, que mide casi 950 kilómetros. Y, por si todo esto fuera poco, habrá 30 kilómetros de «calle» con sus correspondientes servicios de alumbrado, riego, aceras, mobiliario urbano y servicios, un kilometraje similar a la distancia entre Madrid capital y el municipio de Móstoles, por ejemplo.

    http://www.abc.es/local-madrid/20130510/abci-eurovegas-arrancara-edificacion-similar-201305082309.html

  • #91330
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Tomás Gomez, head of the Madrid Socialists, says the project “has collapsed”, according to news reports today. Rumor has it that Adelson is now looking at Vietnam (for a “Eurovegas” theme park 😆 )

    Allegedly he couldn’t get a syndicated loan for €6 billion to get the project of the ground. I can’t believe this is the real reason. You don’t waste scarce management time with projects like this if you don’t have the most critical thing of all already lined up.

  • #118812
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    The plug has definitively been pulled on this project. Apparently Adelson was asking too much. He wanted the Spanish state to guarantee all losses if his business didn’t work, and a bunch of other things. So that’s the end of that.

    Now just have to see what happens with Barcelona World. I think it’s got a slightly better chance of getting off the ground, though not as good as Barcelona Island, a sound project if ever there was one 😆 .

    Then, of course, there’s always the Paramount Theme Park in Murcia 😆 😆 😆 😆

  • #118803
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    The last-minute requests from Adelson indicate that wanted out or thought that the Spanish were so desperate that they would approve anything.

    I’m guessing that he got cold-feet at the last minute.

  • #118806
    Profile photo of Chopera
    Chopera
    Participant

    @garysfbcn wrote:

    The last-minute requests from Adelson indicate that wanted out or thought that the Spanish were so desperate that they would approve anything.

    I’m guessing that he got cold-feet at the last minute.

    Yes it looks like he made it impossible for Madrid to agree. Probably the best outcome for all concerned.

  • #118807
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    What did the Spaniards think of some from his background ???

  • #118809
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

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