Heading for the exit

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This topic contains 56 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of logan logan 4 years, 3 months ago.

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  • #56210
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    Anonymous
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    BBC article in the woes of migrant workers in Spain.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-13271505

  • #104381
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    It’s a bit like musical chairs, the jobless Spanish are looking at Germany:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12359897

  • #104181
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    It’s a bit like musical chairs, the jobless Spanish are looking at Germany:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12359897

  • #104382
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Here’s a bit of good news.
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-05-04/spanish-registered-unemployment-falls-for-first-time-this-year.html
    Probably just a seasonal blip but perhaps with the government paying migrants to leave it’s massaged the figures. 🙁

  • #104182
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Here’s a bit of good news.
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-05-04/spanish-registered-unemployment-falls-for-first-time-this-year.html
    Probably just a seasonal blip but perhaps with the government paying migrants to leave it’s massaged the figures. 🙁

  • #104384
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    …..and how many skilled but unemployed Spanish have left for Germany? Lower unemployment figures do not mean more jobs being created in Spain, much as the Government would like us to believe. Same in Greece, some of the best brains/skilled workers are leaving.

  • #104184
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    …..and how many skilled but unemployed Spanish have left for Germany? Lower unemployment figures do not mean more jobs being created in Spain, much as the Government would like us to believe. Same in Greece, some of the best brains/skilled workers are leaving.

  • #104385
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Charlie, This is the reality of life. It can be a Country or a business!!! The best brains are marketable all over the world & in what ever economic cycle we go through.

    The policy sugguested is a knee jerk reaction & taken up for political milage. The Spanish must have learnt this from the French. Like most of their policies. ( Notorial system, civil service, states knows best, high taxation etc, comes to mind )

    What will happen when the economy recover’s these people or their skills will not be there and such either slow the recovery or create a economic/productivity drag on the recovery.

  • #104185
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Charlie, This is the reality of life. It can be a Country or a business!!! The best brains are marketable all over the world & in what ever economic cycle we go through.

    The policy sugguested is a knee jerk reaction & taken up for political milage. The Spanish must have learnt this from the French. Like most of their policies. ( Notorial system, civil service, states knows best, high taxation etc, comes to mind )

    What will happen when the economy recover’s these people or their skills will not be there and such either slow the recovery or create a economic/productivity drag on the recovery.

  • #104218
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    same thing has happened here with all the polish guys who came to work on the building sites alot of them have gone home or moved on to the next building hot spot

  • #104405
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    same thing has happened here with all the polish guys who came to work on the building sites alot of them have gone home or moved on to the next building hot spot

  • #104220
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    The Polish that I have come accross had/have a clear exit plan. They worked hard and at all times of the day & always with a smile occassionaly hit the Vodka on a sunday night when they got together.
    Their plans were to making money to build there house, buy land etc once this has been acheived they leave or have left.
    There are other reasons mainly when they came here the Zlty for nearly 8 to a £, at present it is around 4.50.

    I know a Polish girl her profession can be called a lady of the night. She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    Besides, above with the impending European football & funds from EU to up lift the infrastructure they are in great demand in their own Country. We sholuld not forget that Poland is perhaps the only country whose economic growth has been positive though out the last four years.

  • #104406
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    The Polish that I have come accross had/have a clear exit plan. They worked hard and at all times of the day & always with a smile occassionaly hit the Vodka on a sunday night when they got together.
    Their plans were to making money to build there house, buy land etc once this has been acheived they leave or have left.
    There are other reasons mainly when they came here the Zlty for nearly 8 to a £, at present it is around 4.50.

    I know a Polish girl her profession can be called a lady of the night. She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    Besides, above with the impending European football & funds from EU to up lift the infrastructure they are in great demand in their own Country. We sholuld not forget that Poland is perhaps the only country whose economic growth has been positive though out the last four years.

  • #104222
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    There are lots of Polish working in UK hotels, they are very efficient. There are many on the cruise ships too.

    Over the last few months in the Uk we have had someone to replace a worn gate who was Turkish. Furniture delivery from an Iraqi and a Polish tree surgeon. All have been excellent

  • #104407
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    There are lots of Polish working in UK hotels, they are very efficient. There are many on the cruise ships too.

    Over the last few months in the Uk we have had someone to replace a worn gate who was Turkish. Furniture delivery from an Iraqi and a Polish tree surgeon. All have been excellent

  • #104224
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Katy, what locals dont realise & irrespective of the Country of the locals that when one some leaves their Country for economic reasons that is what their reasons are & as such they will work hard, put their best foot forward etc. They do not come for clubing, partying, appreciating art, culture etc.

    The Turkish is not curious one for me. Why do you think Britian is so keen on the Turks joining EU. Brits were the main protaganist in bringing down the Ottoman Empire. Why this sudden love for the Turks.

    Yes in future when the Poles would have gone or their children holding white collar jobs. Who will do the dirty, low paid jobs ????

  • #104408
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Katy, what locals dont realise & irrespective of the Country of the locals that when one some leaves their Country for economic reasons that is what their reasons are & as such they will work hard, put their best foot forward etc. They do not come for clubing, partying, appreciating art, culture etc.

    The Turkish is not curious one for me. Why do you think Britian is so keen on the Turks joining EU. Brits were the main protaganist in bringing down the Ottoman Empire. Why this sudden love for the Turks.

    Yes in future when the Poles would have gone or their children holding white collar jobs. Who will do the dirty, low paid jobs ????

  • #104226
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    katy
    Spectator

    Yes in future when the Poles would have gone or their children holding white collar jobs. Who will do the dirty, low paid jobs ????

    Hopefully all the chavs living of benefits!

  • #104409
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Yes in future when the Poles would have gone or their children holding white collar jobs. Who will do the dirty, low paid jobs ????

    Hopefully all the chavs living of benefits!

  • #104228
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    a polish girl who works in our local pub is doing exactley what you mention shakeel her a 3 mates have come over and are working till they can go back and buy a flat each, they are all sharing a house and costs i can’t say i blame them i went to work in greece in the early 80’s when work was slow here for me

  • #104410
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    a polish girl who works in our local pub is doing exactley what you mention shakeel her a 3 mates have come over and are working till they can go back and buy a flat each, they are all sharing a house and costs i can’t say i blame them i went to work in greece in the early 80’s when work was slow here for me

  • #104230
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    Nice one Katy!! 🙂

  • #104411
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    Nice one Katy!! 🙂

  • #104232
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Now, Now Katy.

  • #104412
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    Now, Now Katy.

  • #104234
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    There were many stories of Brits working in Germany etc. Indeed there was a TV series about it. I did not see it so dont know how to reality it was.

  • #104413
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    There were many stories of Brits working in Germany etc. Indeed there was a TV series about it. I did not see it so dont know how to reality it was.

  • #104236
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @shakeel wrote:

    There were many stories of Brits working in Germany etc. Indeed there was a TV series about it. I did not see it so dont know how to reality it was.

    a bunch of british blokes working on a building site then going to the pub but with no wife nagging them to come home so they got pissed alot and got into a few scrapes,sound just like real life to me.
    And katy i always thought you were intelligent really chav’s doing jobs for money when they get more in benifits don’t make me laugh
    its more likely to be their parents trying to scape by or oap’s topping up their pensions

  • #104414
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @shakeel wrote:

    There were many stories of Brits working in Germany etc. Indeed there was a TV series about it. I did not see it so dont know how to reality it was.

    a bunch of british blokes working on a building site then going to the pub but with no wife nagging them to come home so they got pissed alot and got into a few scrapes,sound just like real life to me.
    And katy i always thought you were intelligent really chav’s doing jobs for money when they get more in benifits don’t make me laugh
    its more likely to be their parents trying to scape by or oap’s topping up their pensions

  • #104239
    Profile photo of peterhun
    peterhun
    Participant

    She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    My parent-in-laws just bought a house in Poland. 1.5 hectares fields, orchard,woodland, house, workshop. £16K

  • #104416
    Profile photo of peterhun
    peterhun
    Participant

    She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    My parent-in-laws just bought a house in Poland. 1.5 hectares fields, orchard,woodland, house, workshop. £16K

  • #104241
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    That should do nicely. What credit card did they use!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

  • #104417
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    That should do nicely. What credit card did they use!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

  • #104243
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    Chopera
    Participant

    @peterhun wrote:

    She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    My parent-in-laws just bought a house in Poland. 1.5 hectares fields, orchard,woodland, house, workshop. £16K

    I suspect there are quite a few fincas going for those prices dotted around Spain – especially in places like Extremadura

  • #104418
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    Chopera
    Participant

    @peterhun wrote:

    She told me that she has bought a house for her mother & flat for her widowed sister & at present is onto buying one for herself once this is done & she will than return to Poland.

    My parent-in-laws just bought a house in Poland. 1.5 hectares fields, orchard,woodland, house, workshop. £16K

    I suspect there are quite a few fincas going for those prices dotted around Spain – especially in places like Extremadura

  • #104245
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
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    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

  • #104419
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    logan
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    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

  • #104420
    Profile photo of Chopera
    Chopera
    Participant

    @logan wrote:

    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

    I head down to the Cácares region quite regularly as my wife’s family is from there. I agree it is beautiful and completely empty and freezing in winter (I remember seeing an episode of “A Place In The Sun” that tried to lull some poor Brits into living there year round 😯 ). However it might be that the property in Poland described by PeterHun is not much different.

  • #104421
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Yup, these places are cheap to buy into for very sound reasons. 😥
    Poland’s economy is on the up at the moment. That may be a temporary catching up process with the rest of Europe.
    Mind you if you believe the financial press the world’s economy is heading for a thirties style depression.
    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/jeremywarner/100010141/ten-reasons-for-thinking-the-world-economy-is-turning-soft/

  • #104422
    Profile photo of peterhun
    peterhun
    Participant

    That should do nicely. What credit card did they use!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

    Well they got a loan, 14% interest rate. Wages are low here, although multiple home ownership is common. They already own a one bedroom apartment and live in a government provided house (he’s a forest Ranger)

    “However it might be that the property in Poland described by PeterHun is not much different.”

    Plenty of water though, 100m down there is a lake all over Poland. With water, good soil and plenty of sunshine (in summer,in abundance) farming here is a pretty easy life. Isolated living in the countryside can be dull, no matter what country or weather you have. They have as much food as they need and there is a perfect place for a 6m hide with a 360 degree raise view for hunting. So as much wild boar and venison as they can shoot. Winters can be cold, however, it wasn’t much different than the UK last winter. Its drier for sure.

    The house is fully furnished and has all the previous owners possessions, the workshop/garage is full of tools (and homemade wine…)

  • #104423
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    peterhun
    Participant

    Yup, these places are cheap to buy into for very sound reasons

    They are not cheap. 20K euro for a ruin in a waste land. There are many place in the world, UK included, where that sort of thing would be worth precisely nothing, never mind a country with 1.5million mostly new properties lying empty. The price is based on a hope of speculative investment.

    Mind you if you believe the financial press the world’s economy is heading for a thirties style depression.

    Even Germany is beginning to wobble. Personally I’m convinced this is the start of a long worldwide depression. The governments have tried their best but used up their ammunition, nothing left to do.

  • #111885
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    Anonymous
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    @logan wrote:

    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

    I’m sorry, but Extremadura does NOT mean hardhip!

    It means the land at the end of the river Duro.

    No hardhip here, just beautiful unspoilt countryside and historic towns, tradition Spanish with very few foreigners – I love it!

  • #111886
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    Anonymous
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    @chopera wrote:

    @logan wrote:
    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

    I head down to the Cácares region quite regularly as my wife’s family is from there. I agree it is beautiful and completely empty and freezing in winter (I remember seeing an episode of “A Place In The Sun” that tried to lull some poor Brits into living there year round 😯 ). However it might be that the property in Poland described by PeterHun is not much different.

    Freezing in winter? Cáceres? Not whenever I’ve been there. Oh yes, we did have snow two winters ago, it started Saturday evening and stopped about Sunday lunchtime, there was about 8 cm and all the locals came and took photos – it was all gone by Monday morning.

    That was the first snow for 25 years, and there has been none since. Yes you get snow in the Sierra de Gredos mountains in the north east corner but it never lasts in the villages, only on the top of the mountains.

    You don’t get snow in any other part of Extremadura. Occasionally frost on the car windscreen early in the morning but it all goes as soon as the sun rises.

  • #111890
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Cygnus.
    The literal translation of Extremadura does mean extreme hardship in English. No matter.
    I have been invited to spend some time there during this winter. Although I’ve been before never for a quite long visit.
    I would appreciate impartial information on what climate I can expect day and night. Logs fires I understand are essential but day time a max of 15C? Is that realistic? How about the rain fall?
    Not worried about much else I can leave 21st century life behind without a tear.
    Thanks

  • #111891
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    DBMarcos99
    Participant

    If you want harsh cold winters head for the Teruel area in Aragon.
    Even in the peak of summer the nights can be chilly there. On the map it’s only a few miles inland from Valencia, but in climate terms a different world.

  • #111892
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    Anonymous
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    @logan wrote:

    Cygnus.
    The literal translation of Extremadura does mean extreme hardship in English. No matter.
    I have been invited to spend some time there during this winter. Although I’ve been before never for a quite long visit.
    I would appreciate impartial information on what climate I can expect day and night. Logs fires I understand are essential but day time a max of 15C? Is that realistic? How about the rain fall?
    Not worried about much else I can leave 21st century life behind without a tear.
    Thanks

    Logan it may be a literal translation in English but it’s not where the name came from and certainly dosn’t describe the he region or life here.

    The weather in winter depends on where you are; Extremadura is a big place, the size of Switzerland or Holland. Here in Trujillo and further south daytime temperatures normally 8 -10 degrees, certainly 15 degrees if you are in the sun. Walk down one side of the street in the sun and you can walk in short sleeves, on the other side in the shade you’ll need a coat. Assuming the sun is shining (as it does most days) it’s plenty warm enough to sit outside for lunch.

    Rain varies but tends to come in batches – a week or so rain and then the sun comes out again. The last two winters have been pretty dry although the rain seemed to enjoy coming at fiesta time such as the Cheese Fair weekend and Semana Santa!

    In the north west in the Sierra de Gata and the west close to the border with Potugal it’s a bit wetter and a few degrees colder but still plenty of sunny winter days to enjoy.

    And as I said in the Sierra de Gredos in the north east they do get some snow but it doesn’t last, except on the tops of the mountains and some of the northern slopes.

    A pretty healthy climate all year round with low humidity even in summer.

    You need heating in the house during the winter, don’t forget the houses are designed for summer rather than winter. Usually tiled floors, no carpets, tiled or painted walls, no wallpaper, often quite thin curtains. Most don’t have double glazing and only a very few have cavity walls or damp courses.

    But we survive! Wild horses wouldn’t drag me back to UK!

    Hope that helps

    Martyn

  • #111893
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    logan
    Participant

    Many thanks Martyn much appreciated, very useful information.
    It;s always a difficult business getting hands on impartial advice. Think I’m going to give it a try.

  • #111894
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    katy
    Spectator

    Some parts of Extremadura are very nice, lovely area to spend a few days. Some areas have problems with shanty towns set up by gypsies, mainly the Roma. The province is also suffering financially.

    I would gouge out my eyes and walk over hot coals rather than live in that backwater…like giving up on life, either have your own company or mix with a majority if uneducated inbreds!

  • #111895
    Profile photo of Chopera
    Chopera
    Participant

    @Cygnus wrote:

    @chopera wrote:
    @logan wrote:
    Almost Chopera.
    http://www.extremacasa.com/ptylist.php
    However remember Extremadura translated means ‘hardship’ in English. I have spent some time in the region, it’s beautiful, remote and empty.

    I head down to the Cácares region quite regularly as my wife’s family is from there. I agree it is beautiful and completely empty and freezing in winter (I remember seeing an episode of “A Place In The Sun” that tried to lull some poor Brits into living there year round 😯 ). However it might be that the property in Poland described by PeterHun is not much different.

    Freezing in winter? Cáceres? Not whenever I’ve been there. Oh yes, we did have snow two winters ago, it started Saturday evening and stopped about Sunday lunchtime, there was about 8 cm and all the locals came and took photos – it was all gone by Monday morning.

    That was the first snow for 25 years, and there has been none since. Yes you get snow in the Sierra de Gredos mountains in the north east corner but it never lasts in the villages, only on the top of the mountains.

    You don’t get snow in any other part of Extremadura. Occasionally frost on the car windscreen early in the morning but it all goes as soon as the sun rises.

    Yup I was referring to los Gredos region, where the mountains are covered in snow each winter, and the winds coming off them are bitterly cold:

  • #111896
    Profile photo of Chopera
    Chopera
    Participant

    @Cygnus wrote:

    @logan wrote:
    Cygnus.
    The literal translation of Extremadura does mean extreme hardship in English. No matter.
    I have been invited to spend some time there during this winter. Although I’ve been before never for a quite long visit.
    I would appreciate impartial information on what climate I can expect day and night. Logs fires I understand are essential but day time a max of 15C? Is that realistic? How about the rain fall?
    Not worried about much else I can leave 21st century life behind without a tear.
    Thanks

    Logan it may be a literal translation in English but it’s not where the name came from and certainly dosn’t describe the he region or life here.

    The weather in winter depends on where you are; Extremadura is a big place, the size of Switzerland or Holland. Here in Trujillo and further south daytime temperatures normally 8 -10 degrees, certainly 15 degrees if you are in the sun. Walk down one side of the street in the sun and you can walk in short sleeves, on the other side in the shade you’ll need a coat. Assuming the sun is shining (as it does most days) it’s plenty warm enough to sit outside for lunch.

    Rain varies but tends to come in batches – a week or so rain and then the sun comes out again. The last two winters have been pretty dry although the rain seemed to enjoy coming at fiesta time such as the Cheese Fair weekend and Semana Santa!

    In the north west in the Sierra de Gata and the west close to the border with Potugal it’s a bit wetter and a few degrees colder but still plenty of sunny winter days to enjoy.

    And as I said in the Sierra de Gredos in the north east they do get some snow but it doesn’t last, except on the tops of the mountains and some of the northern slopes.

    A pretty healthy climate all year round with low humidity even in summer.

    You need heating in the house during the winter, don’t forget the houses are designed for summer rather than winter. Usually tiled floors, no carpets, tiled or painted walls, no wallpaper, often quite thin curtains. Most don’t have double glazing and only a very few have cavity walls or damp courses.

    But we survive! Wild horses wouldn’t drag me back to UK!

    Hope that helps

    Martyn

    Yes the old saying that Spain is a cold country with a very hot sun definitely has a ring of truth to it.

    It’s been a while since I last stopped off at Trujillo, we usually hang around Jarandilla de La Vera. Earlier this year I visited Cácares town itself and was pleasantly surprised, especially at how well preserved the old quarter is. We’ve been to Merida a few times, in the summer there are various performances in the Roman theatre that are well worth visiting, just for the ambience.

  • #111897
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    Chopera
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    Some parts of Extremadura are very nice, lovely area to spend a few days. Some areas have problems with shanty towns set up by gypsies, mainly the Roma. The province is also suffering financially.

    I would gouge out my eyes and walk over hot coals rather than live in that backwater…like giving up on life, either have your own company or mix with a majority if uneducated inbreds!

    Hmmm and what kind of education prompted you to come out with a comment like that?

  • #111899
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    Some parts of Extremadura are very nice, lovely area to spend a few days. Some areas have problems with shanty towns set up by gypsies, mainly the Roma. The province is also suffering financially.

    I would gouge out my eyes and walk over hot coals rather than live in that backwater…like giving up on life, either have your own company or mix with a majority if uneducated inbreds!

    That’s not the Extremadura or the residents that I know.

    Mind you, one of the reasons that I love living here is that there are so few ex-pats, it’s very Spanish, very traditional, very beautiful and very laid back – and extremely friendly locals. And not a shanty town in sight!

  • #111900
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    katy
    Spectator

    Well there wouldn’t be many ex-pats would there 🙄 Plenty of Romanians and North Africans :mrgreen: We saw lots of chabolas when we were there about 3 years ago.

  • #111902
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    Well there wouldn’t be many ex-pats would there 🙄 Plenty of Romanians and North Africans :mrgreen: We saw lots of chabolas when we were there about 3 years ago.

    I can’t believe we are talking about the same place, but I’m not going to argue with you. Each to his own.

  • #111903
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    I rather agree with Cygnos. I have spent some time there a few days only. Also the Alentejo in Portugal which is similar and a geographical extension of Extremadura though of course not the same.
    It is a matter of ‘horses for courses’, we are all different and all have separate needs and tastes. Does not mean one is right the other wrong, just wrong for Katy right for Cygnos. 8)
    Winters are cold and wet there, very similar to my part of France I’ve done more research. This is a negative and a good reason not to spend a three months sabbatical there.
    I would need more convincing.

  • #111904
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    katy
    Spectator

    It is a good place to visit 🙂 bear in mind it is one of the poorest regions in Spain. If I were going to choose an unspoilt area it would be galicía.

  • #111905
    Profile photo of logan
    logan
    Participant

    Galicia is wonderful but wet, cold with Atlantic gales.
    I would normally choose the Algarve for winter since I have spent a few winters there before but to be honest I’m tired of tourist resorts and the same old tat.
    This opportunity came up to stay in Extremadura, it’s different as well as slightly challenging. The property is very remote.
    That’s a kind of heaven but has it’s down sides but is useful for my needs.

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