GLOBAL WARMING

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This topic contains 13 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Anonymous Anonymous 2 years, 8 months ago.

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  • #57982
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Reports today pointing to an increase in extreme climate conditions might they suggest that buying in warmer climates may present problems in future years. Will South and South East Spain become unbearable in the summer months. Will the Canaries become an extension of the African Sahara and camels replace motorbikes with inhabitants migrating to cooler climes. In the UK this last winter was mild and Kent is a blaze of flowers snowdrops and daffodils and tulips . In my town by the coast we have summer flowers aubretia and marigolds in full bloom together with Magnolias and May tree. Other recent years we have had bitterly cold temperatures and some very cold springs as this year in USA. This winter we had in UK SW winds from the Caribean -USA Polar Vortexes and NE trades normally prevalent in summer blew down the west coast of Africa from central Europe to the Canaries this winter where normally there are westerlies -admittedly with the chill taken off over the seas. The evidence very conflicting except to say melting of ice at the ice caps continues and sea levels are rising.

  • #119379
    Profile photo of Tinnat
    Tinnat
    Participant

    You know, up to two years ago, the ski resorts in the Pyrenees had very little snow. The blame was on climate change. Then last year and this year they had an abundance of snow not seen in many years.

    My point is that it’s easy to blame climate change for every type of weather variation we see. But sometimes it’s just that – a normal variation of the weather. I’m not denying climage change exists, by the way.

  • #119380
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    I understand your points Tinnat. The only observation though is how ‘ normal’ are the variations !Indeed it may depend on the time span -over thousands of years the variations are very slight probably at the moment .But to humans that can only survive in a very small range of environmental circumstances in their present stage of development of selves and infrastructural capapability we might still be in this utopian ‘slot’ for now. The variations may go beyond the range that we can adapt to -ok you can have air conditioning in your flat but we might not be able to afford air suits for all and everything else required. If developments are adverse might homo sapiens develop new attributes of survival -be capable of making adequate environmental changes -even giant ice making machines solar reflectors huge air purification filters, re -afforestation tree planting everywhere and heavy penalties for cutting them down or damaging them! I notice in the Canaries previously arid lands are green golf courses sprayed with water probably in part from desalination plants. Draining the seas of excess water could go a long way -its evaporated off and that can change the weather of the location clouds hanging where they have never been seen before. How do you convert this back maybe to ice on the scale required. There is lots man could do together if we could regulate population without destroying the differences that urge procreation and end war and weapons production once and for all !

  • #119382
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    Aaa ah the great global warming con. Hang on, isn’t it called climate change now as a catch all 😆

    April 1st is a very appropriate day for this

  • #119385
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    Aaa ah the great global warming con. Hang on, isn’t it called climate change now as a catch all 😆

    April 1st is a very appropriate day for this

    Katy, I enjoy most of your posts, but the idea that we are not in a time of severe climate change is nonsense. The scientific community is clear on this, as am I: I’ve flown over Greenland multiple times a year every year since 1999, and many times before that starting in 1988. The rate of ‘melt-off’ and shrinking of Greenland in the past 6 years, very visible from an airplane, is alarming.

  • #119386
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    But according to an article in the pro GWing Economist there hasn’t actually been any warming of the Earth’s surface air temp for15 years (May 30th 2013 ‘Climate – A sensitive matter’) despite huge and increased amounts of CO2 being released over the period. This is a surprise it seems… The results don’t tally with the computer models – well thats a surprise too apparently.
    And is it man-made anyway? Sure there’s a consensus – all their depts and grants are dependent on it!
    I’m not into pollution, greedily exploiting the Earth and think sustainables are ‘a good thing’ but wonder if expensive policy changes are really driven by facts?
    The Sahara was created 6-4000 yrs ago from climate change but not anthropogenic (?!).

  • #119388
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    This is a very serious issue and not something to be taken lightly. We have to rely on the physical changes we can see and those we experience . There is evidence of increased ice melt of rising sea levels and changes in sea currents like the Gulf Stream that drive climate.There is evidence of glaciers providing reduced water flow as they have decreased in size not only near Alps but also near Andes in South America. There is evidence of eccentricity in temperature -extra summer heat and winter cold. There is evidence of eccentricity in rainfall -drought and floods in different places. This means that different locations will have different experiences -the impact of global warming will not be uniform -because of changes in ocean currents too -it means that places currently uninhabitable may become so and other locations chosen for reasons of more comfortable conditions may cease to be comfortable.When we are seeking to relocate or buy a home for partial use we must be aware of these risks. Not only Somerset got flooded this winter -many holiday homes were flooded in Brittany and vast areas of Spain were snowed under ! The Canaries had some low night temperatures and the summers are getting hotter in the south of the islands. Parts of Scandinavia had a mild winter after several severe ones.15 years too small a time span to mean much and its not global average temperatures that are so much important as the impact on populations in different areas affected by local changes s a result of the ‘eccentricities’. More seriously longer term is whether trigger points will be reached where more dramatic changes come about where methane gas builds in the lower atmosphere due to increased weed and vegetation inwarmer seas surfacing and discharging it. The sea temperature near my North Sea beach today was 8C not bad for time of year some years only 3 or 4C at this time 10 or 11C less than around the Canaries – but it was pleasant for a paddle in the sunshine ! Yes those of use with 5 10 or 20 or so years of life might still enjoy global warming if we choose our extra space in the right places.

  • #119390
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    @alban wrote:

    But according to an article in the pro GWing Economist there hasn’t actually been any warming of the Earth’s surface air temp for15 years (May 30th 2013 ‘Climate – A sensitive matter’) despite huge and increased amounts of CO2 being released over the period. This is a surprise it seems… The results don’t tally with the computer models – well thats a surprise too apparently.
    And is it man-made anyway? Sure there’s a consensus – all their depts and grants are dependent on it!
    I’m not into pollution, greedily exploiting the Earth and think sustainables are ‘a good thing’ but wonder if expensive policy changes are really driven by facts?
    The Sahara was created 6-4000 yrs ago from climate change but not anthropogenic (?!).

    You are right to be sceptical, it’s almost turning into a religion and there is money in it too. Just google climate change scam. Remember climategate when they tried to suppress all the figures.

  • #119391
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    It must be obvious to anybody Katy if you keep concreting over the land areas of the globe and churn out filth and cut down the oxygen producing trees there has to be a result -this we have some control over if we don’t about volcanoes or rocks in space. For an ordinary holidaymaker who may flit around from spot to spot not an issue but it needs thinking about if you are buying somewhere . Locations near sea are better in summer heat and cheaper to run. A few kilometres in land and if things get worse it might be uncomfortable in the summer. I think who is making money out of speculation about global warming and what truth there is in speculation is less important than forward planning for eventualities-and easier said thasn done sometimes !

  • #119392
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    If global warming was as drastic as the fraudsters claim then the last place to live is near the sea 😆

  • #119393
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    You are funny Katy but at least you are alive and kicking . This site is -king dead ! Your last comment probably sums up Spain. I regret buying there – I enjoyed it better when I just travelled to hotels with a friend when I wanted to and paid in pesetas. However never blame the ordinary people -lovely ladies in my Catholic village -its not their fault. They say there is no democracy in Spain we are victims too.

  • #119397
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Yes it has become a religion substitute with an Apocalyptic End – Flood and burning and weird portents in the atmosphere;priestly infallible scientists who are stewards of its mysteries who alone can interpret the signs; young evangelists risking life and limb to save the whales or the world with the Green gospel; a new ‘ethics’ that mean you’re righteous if you use a self-composting toilet and an harmonious heaven of organic sustainabilty.
    Nah give me the old-time religion of God’s grace, care for one’s neighbour, censure of greed and respect for Creation.

  • #119399
    Profile photo of GarySFBCN
    GarySFBCN
    Participant

    @alban wrote:

    Yes it has become a religion substitute with an Apocalyptic End – Flood and burning and weird portents in the atmosphere;priestly infallible scientists who are stewards of its mysteries who alone can interpret the signs; young evangelists risking life and limb to save the whales or the world with the Green gospel; a new ‘ethics’ that mean you’re righteous if you use a self-composting toilet and an harmonious heaven of organic sustainabilty.
    Nah give me the old-time religion of God’s grace, care for one’s neighbour, censure of greed and respect for Creation.

    Actually, it is not a “religion” for most of us. I don’t know anyone who is environmentally aware and has replaced their spiritual beliefs with this environmental awareness and practice. We know that, regardless if you believe 99% of the world’s scientists or not, reducing one’s impact on the environment is better for everyone and saves money in the long run.

    These efforts have tangible results and are not contrary to the foundational documents of most religions.

    There is a very small lunatic fringe in the scientific community who dispute either the long-term effects of global climate change or the underlying causes or both*. But they too, would reject any nonsense coming from the leaders and members of the same types of organizations that kept Galileo under house arrest for 10 years.

    *A search of over 14,000 documents going back to 1991 regarding human causes of ‘global warming’ show that only 24 of those documents rejected human causes.

    http://www.weather.com/news/science/environment/startling-number-scientists-dispute-human-caused-global-warming-20140122

  • #119403
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    But some environmentalists react with an almost evangelical zeal in condemning ‘deniers’ and not allowing a doubt into their minds. As I said according to actual measurements rather than the opinions of the tiny proportion of scientists actually involved in Climate science the Earth hasn’t warmed in 15yrs which does surely make you stop and think? – but I’m no expert I just read an article quoting, er, experts. We all know scientific opinion has been wrong en bloc before and actually no hypothesis should be adhered to too tightly but GW has taken on a kind of hard dogmatic orthodoxy defended to the hilt. We must save humanity! But many good things are brought about by environmentalism.

    Sure GW or environmental activism isn’t against the tenets of any religion. But I see it as taking its place in some ways – with many similar claims on people’s commitment and devotion, propounding a new ‘ethics’. It generates real passion too.

    Galileo story – complicated and not really the evidence that ‘the church is always warring with science’. I wouldn’t defend much of institutional religion but he remained a Christian theist as were Copernicus and Kepler – faith didn’t stop them doing good astronomy. I think G. was actually destroying the false ‘science’ of his day which the Church had foolishly espoused – Aristotlean cosmology with his notion of the perfection of the spheres. In addition a narrow, over-literal reading of the Bible. Could be the Renaissance was what put back science, as medieval monks were getting there before everyone started looking back to ancient Greece for the truth. G. challenged the authority of the Church too as a geo-political institution – always trouble when politics and State get involved with anything. He was also a bit of a pain, personally insulting and wrong about some things too apparently… still no reason to keep him in any kind of, albeit comfortable, house arrest.

    Wattsupwiththat.com boasting itself ‘the most visited web site on Climate change’! offers a reasoned, contrarian view on GWing by a meteorologist, I believe – in my unexpert opinion. Really not a lunatic.

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