Five Arrests in the Murcia Government

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This topic contains 24 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Anonymous Anonymous 9 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #52673
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant
  • #69636
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Tilly
    Perhaps this will take a little heat off the Costa del Sol of a while.
    Corruption is in every country in the world even the good old U.K some may not like to hear.

  • #69637
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Perhaps this will take a little heat off the Costa del Sol of a while.

    It will take more than one headline about Murcia to do that I think.

    http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publish/article_9107.shtml

  • #69638
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    See there were arrests also in France + Holland and I dont think the good old U.K news of late can put us lot on some pedistal.
    Newspapers sell stories.
    Gloom and scandel sells newspapers.
    Gloom,scandel and corruption are in every country in the world and thats why there are newspapers.

  • #69640
    Profile photo of Melosine
    Melosine
    Participant

    Even in UK news people are going to be ousted because homes are illegal.
    Seems it is happening everywhere.

  • #69655
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Is there a check list of documents that need to be completed for renovation of a property or expansion.

    Also, is it correct that you can add to the size of your house by 20% per year. That sounds a bit weird to me but this is Spain we’re talking about.

    I will probably be moving to the Mercia region so want to make sure all my bases are covered from a legal point of view.

  • #69657
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    No, its not correct and you will find that you need a building licence for even the smallest of works that you carry out.

  • #69658
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    No, its not correct and you will find that you need a building licence for even the smallest of works that you carry out.

    How difficult are these to do. Are we talking about a simple form or a 6 month period to get permission to install a new door?

  • #69662
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    It varies depends on the local town hall, its also a bit of a money spinner for them as they need a project cost and they charge a % of the project for the licence. If you are on good terms with them they will say no problem start without it but that in itself can create another problem. It took about 3 months to get a licence here (marbella) for a very small project (and this was some years ago before all the recent problems)

  • #69663
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @Knock-on wrote:

    @katy wrote:
    No, its not correct and you will find that you need a building licence for even the smallest of works that you carry out.

    How difficult are these to do. Are we talking about a simple form or a 6 month period to get permission to install a new door?

    One day or 6 months? Depends on how responsive is the town hall… In Spain there is no general rule.

    Telling when you need a building license or not is quite difficult. As a general rule every kind of renovation or work that can be seen from the outside needs a document called “licensia de obra minor” (not sure about the correct spelling). You also need the same document if you are doing a work that generates a lot of garbage (for examples new tiles to your kitchen, as I did last year). In this case you also need to pay an additional fee on top of the “licensia de obra minor” for the elimination of the waste (the container outside the house).

    hope that this helps

    😉

    Cheers
    Dids

  • #69665
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    Anonymous
    Participant

    What fun 😆

    Is there a similar structure to the UK where you have local Boroughs that grant permission but these are governed by County Councils? For example, suppose we were putting a roof on a derelict property on our land. Would we have to lodge this locally or drive into the regional HQ (ie Mercia or Alicante depend on where we buy?)

  • #69667
    Profile photo of Inez
    Inez
    Participant

    Whichever you have to do make sure you have the regulatory brown paper envelope at the ready 😉

  • #69668
    Profile photo of katy
    katy
    Spectator

    From reading other forums I think a new roof is considered a major project and may also need an architects certificate.

  • #69669
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    @katy wrote:

    From reading other forums I think a new roof is considered a major project and may also need an architects certificate.

    Quite probably. I was going to the extreme.

    As for Brown paper bags, are that for when you lose control of your functions through extreme frustration 😉

    I think from what I understand that dealing with Spanish bureaucracy requires a slightly different mentality. You need to submit the papers and then just take a watching brief. Smile, make friends with the clerks and wait for the weeks to pass in a “it will happen when it will happen” sort of thing.

    If you get all excited and forceful, it just raises your blood pressure and doesn’t get you anywhere. Best to adopt the Spanish way and go with the flow. 🙂

  • #69670
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    You are very right!!

    Making friends with the clerks could improve dramatically the speed of everything… For my kitchen, the “licensia de obra minor” took about a month

  • #69688
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    For smaller projects I would probably try and deal with it personally but when dealing with a large project, eg a full rebuild of a derelict house, is it advisable to have someone employed to act as an agent. I heard that this is expected practice and can jolly things along a bit more efficiently?

  • #69689
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi,

    In Asturias::

    Minor license (obras menor rapido) for putting in a new kitchen took less than an hour to get, as long as it took to go from one building to the other to pay and back again.

    For putting on a new roof, its a minor license (obras menor) but one that takes 28 days, you need a picture of the roof and a map annotated with the location as well as the license application here BUT this all assumes you don’t use scaffolding. If using scaffolding, its a MAJOR works license, requiring a project and architects drawings.

    When we did our roof I made a minor license and was the told by the PLANNING DEPT to write something stating we weren’t using scaffolding (even though we knew we were!!) to avoid the need for a major license…

    Its ‘menor’ and ‘mejor’ in Spanish…

    Agree with everyone else, it will depend on the day, time of month, if you smile sweetly enough etc etc

    It took my husband over 2 months to get us written permission from the ayuntamiento to connect to the mains drainage..evidently I smile sweeter!! 😀

    If you are interested, why haven’t you searched through my old posts as I suggested in my PM to you? There is a thread called ‘Do I really need an architect’ and listed there are the things that need which licence.

    I’ve copied some of the relevant info below,

    According to the LOE, which is the law that regulates all building in Spain, you require a Project for:

    1. All new building, other than simple single storey non-residential or public use building.

    2. The refurbishment, extension or repair of any existing building that affects its size, volume, composition, structure or involves a change of use.

    3. Any works to listed buildings.

    The Project must be signed by an Architect if the use of the building is:

    A) Public, Residential, Religious, Educational, Cultural or a Hospital.

    The Project must be signed by an Architect or an Engineer if the use is:

    B) Transport, Energy Production, Hydraulic, Telecommunications, Industrial, Agricultural etc

    Projects for any other intended use (C) may be signed by an Architect, an Engineer or an Aparejador ( a technical architect whose functions combine those of a Quantity Surveyor and Clerk of Works).

    Minor Works are those that do do not affect the structure, appearance or use of the building: all other works are regarded as Major. Depending on the Local Council, Minor Works Licences are usually granted swiftly (by Spanish standards), and do not require an extensive Project. Major Works Licences require a full project, with Bills of Quantities and detailled drawings, and the use of an Archiect and Aparejador for the site supervision.

    Heather

  • #69692
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    The need for these building licences must vary wildly depending on where in Spain you are.
    We live in what I would call a “medium” sized town in Seville.
    So far I have removed and replaced all the rendering on my outside walls, removed and renewed all the windows. I have also fitted a new bathroom and kitchen and retiled the entire floor area.

    Number of licences applied for = nill.

    And by the way we live just around the corner from the local police station, and town hall, and are in full view of any passing police car, guardia civil officer, town hall officials etc. Not one of them has ever asked to see a licence, even when we had a skip outside and a scaffolding tower while the walls were done.

    jez

  • #69693
    Profile photo of Melosine
    Melosine
    Participant

    Best place to live…nearer the police station the better for things not to be noticed.
    In Murcia any obvious building work in progress the constantly police check.

  • #69699
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Melosine,

    Do not make out the police are on the ball in Murcia. I was robbed of my property in Murcia in 2003.

    THE COURTS IN MURCIA ARE SHIT.

    LIZI

  • #69700
    Profile photo of Melosine
    Melosine
    Participant

    I wasn’t aware I said the police were on the ball to anything except where building was happening where they are constantly patroling my village in Murcia.
    You have had a bad experience and I have every empathy for you but see no reason for your response to me. I was replying as I have found it to be in my area of Murcia.
    Like many others I have been burgled in UK…police worse than useless ..but one has to move on.

  • #69701
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Melosine,

    Apologies if I have offended you.

    Murcia is not the ‘BRIGHT LIGHT’ you make it out to be.

    I know what I am talking about.

    Lizi

  • #69702
    Profile photo of Melosine
    Melosine
    Participant

    Lizi, Not offended just puzzled. Never said anywhere was perfect and am aware out in the campo here a couple of empty properties have been targeted. One very good reason, as with my burglary, why I will never have more than house at a time anywhere now.

  • #69712
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Hi Jez,

    I’m pretty sure the law is the same, its just how bothered the ayuntamiento is that differs!!

    Our builder said that as long as the ayuntamiento has had some money from you, its not bothered!!

    Guess it also depends on whether your neighbours will denounce you to the ayuntamiento…here there is an inspector, if they come and find no licenses you are fined.

    Heather

  • #69741
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Anonymous
    Participant

    Heather

    Thank for the useful advice you have given me by PM and on this thread.

    I must admit, I hadn’t searched back through all your posts as you suggested as I forgot 😳 Been working my little butt off trying to get all the basic information down, get some basic law books and learning Spanish. 😯 However, now things are fitting together, I will make the effort.

    This forum has provided such a wealth of information that I may have missed some posts or not acted on them. Please, if this is the case, do not think I am ignoring them.

    Regards

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